realtek and dolby out of sync


R

Robin Bignall

I installed latest Realtek driver and now Dolby Home Theatre tells me
drivers do not match. Can't find any downloads on Dolby site, not any
mention of Dolby on motherboard driver disk. Any ideas?
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

I installed latest Realtek driver and now Dolby Home Theatre tells me
drivers do not match. Can't find any downloads on Dolby site, not any
mention of Dolby on motherboard driver disk. Any ideas?
All I can think of is to find the Dolby drivers (or maybe the Audio
drivers?) in the Device Manager and on the Drivers tab, choose either
Roll Back Driver or the Update Driver.

In my Device Manager, under Sound, video and game controllers, I see
four entries that say NVIDIA High Definition Audio and one that says
Realtek High Definition Audio. That doesn't simplify the issue...

Here's some more information which doesn't help me at all. The NVIDIA
ones are for four internal HD audio buses numbered 0-3 on the video
card. The Realtek one is similar, for the onboard sound, It has just the
one bus numbered 0.

As I get ready to send this, I have to add: let's hope someone else
actually *understands* the situation & replies to you :)
 
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R

Robin Bignall

All I can think of is to find the Dolby drivers (or maybe the Audio
drivers?) in the Device Manager and on the Drivers tab, choose either
Roll Back Driver or the Update Driver.

In my Device Manager, under Sound, video and game controllers, I see
four entries that say NVIDIA High Definition Audio and one that says
Realtek High Definition Audio. That doesn't simplify the issue...

Here's some more information which doesn't help me at all. The NVIDIA
ones are for four internal HD audio buses numbered 0-3 on the video
card. The Realtek one is similar, for the onboard sound, It has just the
one bus numbered 0.
My device manager has just one line item: Realtek driver. I rolled it
back and got a M$ driver, which didn't solve the problem. I rolled it
forward again.

In Program Files / Dolby there're umpteen language files and a few .exe
files, but no setup.
As I get ready to send this, I have to add: let's hope someone else
actually *understands* the situation & replies to you :)
Me, too. Incidentally, I have nothing like a Dolby Theatre setup, so I
can just x the thing out in Autoruns and forget about it. But it
niggles me that installing the latest Realtek driver has apparently left
the Dolby drivers behind the times without any apparent way to update
them. The Dolby application simply won't start: nor will its control
panel.
 
P

Paul

Robin said:
My device manager has just one line item: Realtek driver. I rolled it
back and got a M$ driver, which didn't solve the problem. I rolled it
forward again.

In Program Files / Dolby there're umpteen language files and a few .exe
files, but no setup.


Me, too. Incidentally, I have nothing like a Dolby Theatre setup, so I
can just x the thing out in Autoruns and forget about it. But it
niggles me that installing the latest Realtek driver has apparently left
the Dolby drivers behind the times without any apparent way to update
them. The Dolby application simply won't start: nor will its control
panel.
The reason the drivers work that way, is some of the Dolby technology is
licensed, and paid for on a per-chip basis (royalty). Some of the packages
RealTek offers (base HDaudio chip plus custom software package), they charge
the motherboard manufacturer more for that, than for a generic chip-only
solution.

There's got to be some way they track such things. The last thing they want,
is the Dolby lawyers coming after them, because they "gave out too many
copies of the software". So some feature there, must "police" whether the
Dolby is to work or not. If you go back to the original driver, I presume
it'll work again.

If it was tracked by Plug and Play information, like Subsystem numbers specific
to the Dolby product SKUs, then downloading a fresh driver from RealTek
would have worked. If they're not tracking it that way, and the original
driver was simply a custom version, then only the motherboard manufacturer
will have rights to newer custom versions to replace that with.

Just a guess,
Paul
 
C

charlie

All I can think of is to find the Dolby drivers (or maybe the Audio
drivers?) in the Device Manager and on the Drivers tab, choose either
Roll Back Driver or the Update Driver.

In my Device Manager, under Sound, video and game controllers, I see
four entries that say NVIDIA High Definition Audio and one that says
Realtek High Definition Audio. That doesn't simplify the issue...

Here's some more information which doesn't help me at all. The NVIDIA
ones are for four internal HD audio buses numbered 0-3 on the video
card. The Realtek one is similar, for the onboard sound, It has just the
one bus numbered 0.

As I get ready to send this, I have to add: let's hope someone else
actually *understands* the situation& replies to you :)
Realtek drivers can be a problem. Since you have NVidia HD audio as
well, and, I suspect, the drivers are also loaded, what about using the
NVidia audio. I realize that the NVidia outputs are not high level, as
the MBD Realtek outputs might be. I have an older MBD that uses an
oddball realtek chip and driver, and the only way to update it involves
some gyrations to force the new versions to install. It turns out that
the newer version drivers work, but do not recognize the oddball realtek
chip designation. It's a minor variant of a very common Realtek chip.
 
R

Robin Bignall

The reason the drivers work that way, is some of the Dolby technology is
licensed, and paid for on a per-chip basis (royalty). Some of the packages
RealTek offers (base HDaudio chip plus custom software package), they charge
the motherboard manufacturer more for that, than for a generic chip-only
solution.

There's got to be some way they track such things. The last thing they want,
is the Dolby lawyers coming after them, because they "gave out too many
copies of the software". So some feature there, must "police" whether the
Dolby is to work or not. If you go back to the original driver, I presume
it'll work again.

If it was tracked by Plug and Play information, like Subsystem numbers specific
to the Dolby product SKUs, then downloading a fresh driver from RealTek
would have worked. If they're not tracking it that way, and the original
driver was simply a custom version, then only the motherboard manufacturer
will have rights to newer custom versions to replace that with.

Just a guess,
Hopefully a good one. I'll try the original later. But it's a weird
problem. The message I get is that "the Dolby audio driver is
7.2.8000.13 while the software expects 7.2.7000.4".

I downloaded 7.2.7000.4 last night, and when I click on Dolby in add/del
programs, that's the one that's installed. That driver is the only line
item under Dolby in add/del programs, so I have no idea what software
they're talking about or where 7.2.8000.13 is to be found. It's not in
device manager.

.... <later>

OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
 
R

Robin Bignall

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]
OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

Realtek drivers can be a problem. Since you have NVidia HD audio as
well, and, I suspect, the drivers are also loaded,
Well, since, as I said, I see them in Device Manager, I will assume they
are there.
what about using the
NVidia audio. I realize that the NVidia outputs are not high level, as
the MBD Realtek outputs might be. I have an older MBD that uses an
oddball realtek chip and driver, and the only way to update it involves
some gyrations to force the new versions to install. It turns out that
the newer version drivers work, but do not recognize the oddball realtek
chip designation. It's a minor variant of a very common Realtek chip.
I am having no problems with my audio, so I see no reason to mess
around.
 
P

Paul

Robin said:
On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]
OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
What if you get a driver right from the RealTek site ?
What happens then ?

http://www.realtek.com.tw/downloads/

Paul
 
C

Char Jackson

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]
OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
Hardware Helper? Is that what they're discussing here?
<http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/114863-program-named-hardware-helper.html>

If so, dump it ASAP, IMHO.
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]
OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
Hardware Helper? Is that what they're discussing here?
<http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/114863-program-named-hardware-helper.html>

If so, dump it ASAP, IMHO.
It would be nice if they gave some reasons or some anecdotal evidence
for not using the program.

But anyway, I don't plan to use it :)
 
C

Char Jackson

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]

OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.

I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
Hardware Helper? Is that what they're discussing here?
<http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/114863-program-named-hardware-helper.html>

If so, dump it ASAP, IMHO.
It would be nice if they gave some reasons or some anecdotal evidence
for not using the program.
As soon as I realized it might be a program that scans your system and
looks for drivers that might be out of date, I had seen enough.
Drivers should be updated only on an as needed basis and never because
a new version is available. Therefore, these kinds of programs are
pure snake oil, in my opinion.

Google has numerous links that mention this program and others like
it. I'm guessing that very few are complimentary, and in fact I didn't
look long enough to see even one that was positive. Most articles
begin with someone's sad tale of how they used one of these programs
and wrecked a perfectly good working system.
But anyway, I don't plan to use it :)
Same here. :)
 
P

Paul

Gene said:
It would be nice if they gave some reasons or some anecdotal evidence
for not using the program.

But anyway, I don't plan to use it :)
For me, it's a matter of the "trust chain".

I trust a RealTek driver I get directly from the RealTek site.

I don't trust a driver that comes from the Driver Helper server.

While good AV software can catch things known to exist, nothing
would stop the owner of the Driver Helper site from inserting
their own custom malware.

So it's a matter of trust. Or expense, for the ones that
charge money for the privilege of (trying to) identify
your drivers for you.

In one of those driver programs, the menu offered after the
scan, had roughly twice as many drivers listed, as were actually
needed. So some of the programs "plump up the menu", to make
like they're doing you a big favor.

*******

On my WinXP machine, I don't even take the drivers off the Windows Update
menu, because 9 times out of 10, the version doesn't exist in the wild,
and there's something wrong with it. It's possible the ones offered
in Windows 7, aren't quite as obscure in terms of versioning.

I got a driver once from Microsoft (default ATI driver for my video
card, on the installer CD), that only operated one of the two display
channels on the card. If you played a 3D game, and alt-tabbed out,
all acceleration in the desktop was disabled. That's the kind of
thing Microsoft distributes. Well... tested... stuff...

Paul
 
R

Robin Bignall

Robin said:
On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:32 +0100, Robin Bignall

[..]
OK, so I reinstalled the motherboard version and Dolby works again. I
watched the uninstall, and there were some .msi's for Dolby, so it's
part of the Realtek update: except that the latest Realtek update
downloads something that's incompatible with what I've already got.

This is all very fragile; quite unlike what one expects from W7
Ultimate. I either have to throw away all new Realtek updates found by
Hardware Helper, or Autorun out Dolby. I never intend to watch TV or
play Hi Fi on my PC, so the latter is what I'll do: in fact, uninstall
Dolby altogether.
I watched the install of the latest Realtek driver; it works fine but no
Dolby, and the modules all had Vista on them, so I wonder if Hardware
Helper has found the wrong driver for W7?
What if you get a driver right from the RealTek site ?
What happens then ?

http://www.realtek.com.tw/downloads/
I have no idea which one to choose. Their names and version numbers
relate to nothing I have installed.
 
R

Robin Bignall

For me, it's a matter of the "trust chain".

I trust a RealTek driver I get directly from the RealTek site.

I don't trust a driver that comes from the Driver Helper server.

While good AV software can catch things known to exist, nothing
would stop the owner of the Driver Helper site from inserting
their own custom malware.

So it's a matter of trust. Or expense, for the ones that
charge money for the privilege of (trying to) identify
your drivers for you.

In one of those driver programs, the menu offered after the
scan, had roughly twice as many drivers listed, as were actually
needed. So some of the programs "plump up the menu", to make
like they're doing you a big favor.

*******

On my WinXP machine, I don't even take the drivers off the Windows Update
menu, because 9 times out of 10, the version doesn't exist in the wild,
and there's something wrong with it. It's possible the ones offered
in Windows 7, aren't quite as obscure in terms of versioning.

I got a driver once from Microsoft (default ATI driver for my video
card, on the installer CD), that only operated one of the two display
channels on the card. If you played a 3D game, and alt-tabbed out,
all acceleration in the desktop was disabled. That's the kind of
thing Microsoft distributes. Well... tested... stuff...
I bought the commercial version. It downloads the drivers, they're
subjected to the usual virus check for anything downloaded, and you
CHOOSE whether to install them. Each driver has full details of where
it came from, version, date etc. and you can check back to the source to
verify veracity.
 
P

Paul

Robin said:
I bought the commercial version. It downloads the drivers, they're
subjected to the usual virus check for anything downloaded, and you
CHOOSE whether to install them. Each driver has full details of where
it came from, version, date etc. and you can check back to the source to
verify veracity.
So when you look at the file name, do you see something similar offered
in the HDaudio section of the RealTek site ?

Motherboard audio solutions (at least for recent systems), are
either AC'97 (five years ago) or HDAudio (modern). The RealTek HDAudio
driver should be a "jumbo" driver, which handles most all of their
HDAudio sound chips.

Some chips in the past were PCI, and an enthusiast sound solution from
years ago, might have included a PCI chip soldered to the motherboard.
But for most of the rest, they're the simpler AC'97 or HDAudio, where there's
no intelligence to speak of, and the chip functions as an "audio pipe".
You send samples to the chip, and it has ADC and DACs for making analog
voltages to/from the samples.

The audio driver package, will usually have a huge .inf file. And that
file includes mappings from chip facilities, to the port wiring on
the motherboard. If a chip supports "three jack" and "six jack"
installations, the .inf file helps sort out and get the jack
assignments right.

Paul
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

For me, it's a matter of the "trust chain".

I trust a RealTek driver I get directly from the RealTek site.

I don't trust a driver that comes from the Driver Helper server.

While good AV software can catch things known to exist, nothing
would stop the owner of the Driver Helper site from inserting
their own custom malware.

So it's a matter of trust. Or expense, for the ones that
charge money for the privilege of (trying to) identify
your drivers for you.

In one of those driver programs, the menu offered after the
scan, had roughly twice as many drivers listed, as were actually
needed. So some of the programs "plump up the menu", to make
like they're doing you a big favor.

*******

On my WinXP machine, I don't even take the drivers off the Windows Update
menu, because 9 times out of 10, the version doesn't exist in the wild,
and there's something wrong with it. It's possible the ones offered
in Windows 7, aren't quite as obscure in terms of versioning.

I got a driver once from Microsoft (default ATI driver for my video
card, on the installer CD), that only operated one of the two display
channels on the card. If you played a 3D game, and alt-tabbed out,
all acceleration in the desktop was disabled. That's the kind of
thing Microsoft distributes. Well... tested... stuff...

Paul
You and Char have now given reasons, and thank you both for that, but
what my post meant by "they" was the posters on the forum that Char
pointed to.

The posts there essentially just said "Don't use it" without hinting at
any reasons.
 
R

Robin Bignall

So when you look at the file name, do you see something similar offered
in the HDaudio section of the RealTek site ?
The version names do not match. That's why I had trouble with
downloading anything from Realtek, but... see below...
Motherboard audio solutions (at least for recent systems), are
either AC'97 (five years ago) or HDAudio (modern). The RealTek HDAudio
driver should be a "jumbo" driver, which handles most all of their
HDAudio sound chips.

Some chips in the past were PCI, and an enthusiast sound solution from
years ago, might have included a PCI chip soldered to the motherboard.
But for most of the rest, they're the simpler AC'97 or HDAudio, where there's
no intelligence to speak of, and the chip functions as an "audio pipe".
You send samples to the chip, and it has ADC and DACs for making analog
voltages to/from the samples.

The audio driver package, will usually have a huge .inf file. And that
file includes mappings from chip facilities, to the port wiring on
the motherboard. If a chip supports "three jack" and "six jack"
installations, the .inf file helps sort out and get the jack
assignments right.
I picked out the latest Win 7,8, Vista driver from Realtek (50 GB) and
installed it. It works but there's still the mismatch with Dolby.
Exactly the same message.
 
C

Char Jackson

I picked out the latest Win 7,8, Vista driver from Realtek (50 GB) and
installed it. It works but there's still the mismatch with Dolby.
Exactly the same message.
50GB? :) Probably 50 MB.
 
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R

Robin Bignall

I picked out the latest Win 7,8, Vista driver from Realtek (50 GB) and
installed it. It works but there's still the mismatch with Dolby.
Exactly the same message.
Incidentally, the latest Realtek driver according to Hardware Helper is
6.0.1.6649. The one I just downloaded from Realtek is 6.0.1.6662. Both
of these are about 50 mB.
The one on the Realtek site is 6.0.1.6554, and is over 100 mB, the
difference, presumably, being Dolby.
 

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