PC To TV Update


O

OldGuy

I finally got a Media Server working with Win 7 Pro and my Samsung TV.
See previous posts 'PC to TV'.

I found that only one really works: KooRaRoo (free version). Others
did not play from the TV side or did not have folder capability or just
failed completely.

PC Side:
1) can point to folders to include in items available for pushing to
TV.
Push means that I select a movie and tell it to Play To from KooRaRoo
and it just works. The TV immediately starts playing.

2) can create a hierarchy of pseudo folders containing pointers to
media and these match the physical folders.
Note: for best usage you need to put media into proper folders.
i.e. All TV movies of the same show in one folder. why? Because
KooRaRoo presents media by program title not show title. So with a lot
of media it is difficult to determine what media or show that title is
coming from. Just sort into folders and drag to KooRaRoo.
As long as you are on the same disk, drag-drop is quick (not really a
copy but an internal disk directory change).
When you delete from KooRaRoo media list you only remove it from
KooRaRoo and don't actually delete the file.

TV Side:
Push the remote control Content button and there are all the DLNA and
the KooRaRoo top folder icon. Click and all the subfolders presented
are those set up on KooRaRoo. Just click through the folders and pick
media and it plays.

In other words, media can be started from either side: TV or PC.

TV Remote Control Play and Pause from the TV side works.

The only shortcoming I see, and I do not know if it is the TV or
KooRaRoo that does this: TV Remote Control Fast Forward is ify.
Sometimes it works and sometimes it resets the media back to the
beginning. Hard to skip commercials for recorded TV.

And, my Win XP laptops shows up as a Media Player icon on the TV.
Have not tried this but it is supposed to be remote control of the
media player. Put a playlist into media player on the laptop then use
the TV to play. Will try this in a day or two.

Next test is to see if I can point RooRaRoo at my NAS where most of my
media is stored. I this works I will be extra happy.
 
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P

Peter Jason

I finally got a Media Server working with Win 7 Pro and my Samsung TV.
See previous posts 'PC to TV'.

I found that only one really works: KooRaRoo (free version). Others
did not play from the TV side or did not have folder capability or just
failed completely.

I bought a TV card for the motherboard:
"Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-2200 (8940)"
The aerial plugs into the card. This works OK.

The Windows7 "Media Centre" accesses this no
trouble.

I record hundreds of TV movies, and I use
"VideoReDo Plus" to chop out the ads.
 
O

OldGuy

I bought a TV card for the motherboard:
"Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-2200 (8940)"
The aerial plugs into the card. This works OK.

The Windows7 "Media Centre" accesses this no
trouble.

I record hundreds of TV movies, and I use
"VideoReDo Plus" to chop out the ads.
Thanks. I will look at that app.
 
O

OldGuy

Follow up.

Strangely some of my Win7 Pro Media Center TV Recordings play from the
('Content'Remote Control) Samsung TV side on command and some say not
compatible. Any ideas why?
Is there any fast conversion app to content from Win Media Center Recorded
TV to a more standard format?
On the fly?
Running KooRaRoo. Need another codec?
 
P

Paul

OldGuy said:
Follow up.

Strangely some of my Win7 Pro Media Center TV Recordings play from the
('Content'Remote Control) Samsung TV side on command and some say not
compatible. Any ideas why?
Is there any fast conversion app to content from Win Media Center
Recorded TV to a more standard format?
On the fly?
Running KooRaRoo. Need another codec?
You're ahead of us on this one.

You are our lead experimenter :)

*******

Using GSpot or MediaInfo, you can check the codec info
on the recorded movies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GSpot

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mediainfo

Just watch that the MediaInfo installer does not
install a toolbar. That's still on my queue, to check out.

Once you identify the differences, post back and
tell us about your various movies.

Paul
 
E

Ed Cryer

OldGuy said:
Follow up.

Strangely some of my Win7 Pro Media Center TV Recordings play from the
('Content'Remote Control) Samsung TV side on command and some say not
compatible. Any ideas why?
Is there any fast conversion app to content from Win Media Center
Recorded TV to a more standard format?
On the fly?
Running KooRaRoo. Need another codec?
It's the codecs on your TV that do the stuff. And (would you believe
it?) Samsung don't install codecs for everything. Do an update on your
TV for all the ones available.
Beyond that you'll have to find out which formats are supported;
preferably by trial & error rather than by consulting Samsung's manual
(I found I couldn't trust it.)

What I did for the trial process was use the USB port with a memory
stick containing samples of all different formats from my PC. I recall
that there were more unsupported than supported!

Ed
 
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E

Ed Cryer

Ed said:
It's the codecs on your TV that do the stuff. And (would you believe
it?) Samsung don't install codecs for everything. Do an update on your
TV for all the ones available.
Beyond that you'll have to find out which formats are supported;
preferably by trial & error rather than by consulting Samsung's manual
(I found I couldn't trust it.)

What I did for the trial process was use the USB port with a memory
stick containing samples of all different formats from my PC. I recall
that there were more unsupported than supported!

Ed
As for the conversion process there are so many available free programs,
and ones are being added daily, so that by the time you read this the
list will have grown. Google's your friend here.

Ed
 
O

OldGuy

Ed Cryer has brought this to us :
As for the conversion process there are so many available free programs, and
ones are being added daily, so that by the time you read this the list will
have grown. Google's your friend here.

Ed
Well actually no, KooRaRoo is supposed to make an on the fly conversion
compatible with the Samsung TV. See their website. It says so. As I
said some TV recording from Win 7 Media Center play, some do not.
 
O

OldGuy

Ed Cryer submitted this idea :
As for the conversion process there are so many available free programs, and
ones are being added daily, so that by the time you read this the list will
have grown. Google's your friend here.

Ed
Google may be my friend but you guys are "more better" since you may
have first hand experience with several and can recommend your best.
I have Nero Platinum and I think it can to that but I really do not
want to spend weeks doing conversions when there may be an on the fly
converter that will interject itself between the file and the server
app KooRaRoo or whatever.
 
O

OldGuy

After serious thinking Peter Jason wrote :
I bought a TV card for the motherboard:
"Hauppauge WinTV-HVR-2200 (8940)"
The aerial plugs into the card. This works OK.

The Windows7 "Media Centre" accesses this no
trouble.

I record hundreds of TV movies, and I use
"VideoReDo Plus" to chop out the ads.
I am using the HVR-2250. Really nice.
Works fine with Win MC for record and playback.
So I can view locally but I want to view remotely.
 
P

Peter Jason

After serious thinking Peter Jason wrote :

I am using the HVR-2250. Really nice.
Works fine with Win MC for record and playback.
So I can view locally but I want to view remotely.
I never try to view remotely because, after
chopping out the ads, I burn the movies to DVD
(Nero8) and watch them on my DVD player.
Also, I save them to 1TB external HDDs for storage
when a time comes for them to be plugged into a
PVR.
 
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E

Ed Cryer

OldGuy said:
Ed Cryer has brought this to us :

Well actually no, KooRaRoo is supposed to make an on the fly conversion
compatible with the Samsung TV. See their website. It says so. As I
said some TV recording from Win 7 Media Center play, some do not.
Sorry about that. I'll have to download that program and give it a try.
Have you any idea of which file extensions don't play? Is there any list
of acceptable formats in KooRaRoo itself?

Ed
 
O

OldGuy

Ed Cryer has brought this to us :
Sorry about that. I'll have to download that program and give it a try.
Have you any idea of which file extensions don't play? Is there any list of
acceptable formats in KooRaRoo itself?

Ed
I could not find. Let me know if you do please.
As said, some WMediaCenter TV Recordings play and some do not. Maybe
length related or?

Some KooRaRoo operations are not as intuitive as could be. I had to
fiddle for a while.
 
E

Ed Cryer

OldGuy said:
Ed Cryer has brought this to us :

I could not find. Let me know if you do please.
As said, some WMediaCenter TV Recordings play and some do not. Maybe
length related or?

Some KooRaRoo operations are not as intuitive as could be. I had to
fiddle for a while.
I installed KooRaRoo; and here are the results of the UK assessment
panel (me, that is).
I get access through the PC and through the TV Samsung AllShare service;

TV:
Everything appears as in the PC folders; a nicety being one folder
organized by file-types. I can play most of these (videos, music,
pictures) with some exceptions. The exceptions appear to be exactly the
same as when I play media from TV USB. Which makes me suspect strongly
that it's using the TV codecs.

PC
Nothing plays at all; file type not supported; videos, music, pictures.
I've tried the default transcoding settings and others.
A "loading" message always appears on screen, followed by the "not
supported" message.
A relevant part of the log reads;
2013-06-12T16:47:54.730Z [PLT_CtrlPoint::InspectDevice] (3200) INFO:
Inspecting device "00000000-0000-0002-0003-0001e3f07032" detected @
http://192.168.1.1/tr64_igd.xml
2013-06-12T16:47:55.572Z [PLT_DeviceData::SetDescription] (4180) INFO:
root namespace is invalid: urn:dslforum-org:device-1-0
2013-06-12T16:47:55.572Z [PLT_DeviceData::SetDescription] (4180) SEVERE:
NPT_CHECK failed, result=-1 (FAILURE) [((-1))]

There's a user forum at;
http://forum.kooraroo.com/forumdisplay.php/6-Support
and if I wanted to use the program I'd ask there, but (1) it's only free
for a month, and (2) I don't want it.

Ed
 
O

OldGuy

Peter Jason wrote :
I never try to view remotely because, after
chopping out the ads, I burn the movies to DVD
(Nero8) and watch them on my DVD player.
Also, I save them to 1TB external HDDs for storage
when a time comes for them to be plugged into a
PVR.
What do you use to remove ads?
This is a manual operation?

What do you use to convert to mpg?
Is it fast?
 
P

Paul

OldGuy said:
Peter Jason wrote :

What do you use to remove ads?
This is a manual operation?

What do you use to convert to mpg?
Is it fast?
I don't really do video that much.

But the basic principle would be, to design your
workflow to keep the same video format from end to
end. That means, the tuner or recorder, you want a
format that suits the final platform (DVD or hard drive).
Then, the editing tool needs "smart rendering". What
that means is, the editing tool does not re-compress
the whole movie. It stitches the ends of the cut back
together, on I-frame boundaries.

I can see "smart rendering" in the product description here,
as an example. I don't think I have a list, that lists
all of the ones that are "smart".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG_Video_Wizard_DVD

There will be many tools with smart rendering
capability. The "degree of smartness" varies, with some
only remaining smart, if the editor gets to choose the
"most convenient" edit point within a half second of
where you really want to snip. Others might allow editing
any arbitrary frame (as long as you stick with cuts, and
not something more fancy).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG_Video_Wizard_DVD

If you use a workflow, where the movie format changes,
or the style of edits requires compressing the output
again, then, it takes a while. If the tool has
"smart render" and you haven't flubbed some detail
along the way (like, maybe, messing with the audio
or something), then it might well take a very short
time to finish.

Paul
 
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O

OldGuy

Paul brought next idea :
I don't really do video that much.

But the basic principle would be, to design your
workflow to keep the same video format from end to
end. That means, the tuner or recorder, you want a
format that suits the final platform (DVD or hard drive).
Then, the editing tool needs "smart rendering". What
that means is, the editing tool does not re-compress
the whole movie. It stitches the ends of the cut back
together, on I-frame boundaries.

I can see "smart rendering" in the product description here,
as an example. I don't think I have a list, that lists
all of the ones that are "smart".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG_Video_Wizard_DVD

There will be many tools with smart rendering
capability. The "degree of smartness" varies, with some
only remaining smart, if the editor gets to choose the
"most convenient" edit point within a half second of
where you really want to snip. Others might allow editing
any arbitrary frame (as long as you stick with cuts, and
not something more fancy).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG_Video_Wizard_DVD

If you use a workflow, where the movie format changes,
or the style of edits requires compressing the output
again, then, it takes a while. If the tool has
"smart render" and you haven't flubbed some detail
along the way (like, maybe, messing with the audio
or something), then it might well take a very short
time to finish.

Paul
The only media I have problems with is the Win 7 Media Center Recorded
TV.

KooRaRoo that I was able to figure out well enough to use, sometimes
works and sometimes not for this MC Recorded TV. And I see no
definitive reason for why. KooRaRoo does coding changes on the fly to
the Samsung TV. I one time saw KooRaRoo recoding several Recorded TV
programs and I do not know how I commanded that. I have not found what
coding change it does for the Samsung TV but when it works it works
perfectly and plays without glitch. Other formats like FLV just work
and as far as I can tell require no on the fly recoding.
All the Recorded TV plays fine on Media Center and Media Play on the
local PC.

I thought maybe trying to manually recode to MPG? I would have better
luck. But I would spend days and many new TBs of data doing so.
It there was a fast way to recode I could recode then erase after
playing on the remove Samsung TV.
 
P

Paul

OldGuy said:
Paul brought next idea :

The only media I have problems with is the Win 7 Media Center Recorded TV.

KooRaRoo that I was able to figure out well enough to use, sometimes
works and sometimes not for this MC Recorded TV. And I see no
definitive reason for why. KooRaRoo does coding changes on the fly to
the Samsung TV. I one time saw KooRaRoo recoding several Recorded TV
programs and I do not know how I commanded that. I have not found what
coding change it does for the Samsung TV but when it works it works
perfectly and plays without glitch. Other formats like FLV just work
and as far as I can tell require no on the fly recoding.
All the Recorded TV plays fine on Media Center and Media Play on the
local PC.

I thought maybe trying to manually recode to MPG? I would have better
luck. But I would spend days and many new TBs of data doing so.
It there was a fast way to recode I could recode then erase after
playing on the remove Samsung TV.
Acceleration devices, don't generally achieve a high speedup. At
least the ones we can afford at home.

Video cards might be able to speed up transcoding/compression,
by up to around a factor of seven. (Once the video card gets above
a certain "power level", the extra power doesn't seem to help.)
I think the Cell Processor based devices, might be in the same ballpark.
Video seems to be "non-scaleable", so there is a limit to how much
parallelism helps. This is just an observation on my part, from reading
threads on various attempts to spend money and fix the problem.

I may have mentioned it before, but I'll repeat. For any video problem,
you start with GSpot or MediaInfo and get the particulars of the video file.
Discover what is so unique about the format that KooRaRoo cannot play.
You use your Googling skills, feed in the names of the CODECs in the
video content, and see what comments people make about them.

Note - when I give a link like these ones, it's to give you a pointer
to the author's web page. So you'll be less likely to grab a copy from
CNET and get a toolbar you didn't want :) If I gave you a CNET link,
and you got a toolbar for nothing, you'd be pissed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GSpot

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaInfo

Actually, MediaInfo does have a toolbar in the payload. But the author
of MediaInfo is "ethical", and a non-disappearing dialog asks you
whether you want that toolbar to install. Unlike some other toolbar
hijinks, where the dialog box disappears after a second, so you
cannot see it, and you get the toolbar.

Since I've given MediaInfo a basic test (I ran it using WINE in a
Linux VM, something I can do without shutting down Windows), the
output information is not in as useful (to me) format, as GSpot
delivers. With GSpot, I get the technical names for the CODECs,
which makes it easier for me to track down what to do with it.

If I was in your shoes, and had the working Windows format and
the non-working Windows format, I would run the CODEC detecting
tools over both of them, and "compare and contrast", as one of my
teachers would have said back in school :)

HTH,
Paul
 
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O

OldGuy

Thanks for all your help.
Still struggling some but that is life.
I will try all the suggestions you and others made.
 
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