install w7 on 16gb of ram?

[Tinker Tanker]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

 

[VanguardLH]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

And if you go back to the 4GB configuration does the computer then boot
okay? If so, you have bad, wrong, or incompatible new memory modules.

 

[ray]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

Try memtest from a Linux Live CD.

 

[Paul]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

Test with memtest86+ first. Scroll half way down the page, to find
the download links.

http://www.memtest.org/

The test can handle larger quantities of RAM. A couple complete
passes, on the pass counter, error free, is enough testing.

For a quick test, I test the sticks one at a time. That
saves time, in finding seriously defective products.

Then, combine the freshly tested and error free sticks, in larger
configurations. Try 2x4GB next for example, one stick
in each channel.

Remove those two, and try the other two.

Finally, combine all four.

The case with four, may be affected by bus loading. The BIOS
may attempt to automatically reduce the memory bus speed
one notch. And that is to compensate a bit for the processor
memory controller characteristics.

Also, examine the memory proudct packaging, for a statement
about what Vdimm the product uses, to guarantee error free
operation. If the DIMM uses 1.7V, and you're on an AMD system,
you can go into the BIOS and bump up the voltage to the specified
value. Perhaps by default, the BIOS is using a slightly lower
value.

There are some RAM pseudo-standards, such as XMP, that aid in
memory setup. With a motherboard that doesn't support those
kinds of standards, there is still some work for the user to do.
The user is still ultimately responsible, for setting everything
needed to make the memory work. In fact "Auto", isn't always
enough. With the right kind of "dumb" "extreme" memory, you
may need to do some BIOS work, to get it error free.

*******

This isn't a particularly good technique, but you could connect
an empty disk to your new build, insert the Win7 DVD, do an
install, with the network cable disconnected. See how the install
goes. If the install errors out, chances are some hardware
(like your RAM), is causing it.

Another test I use, is to boot a Linux LiveCD. Download a 64 bit
distro, so that it will make use of all the RAM. If "funny things"
happen to the live boot of such a CD/DVD, then that could again
be indirect evidence of a hardware issue. As a stress test,
you can even run Prime95 from Linux. This site has both
Windows and Linux versions of the Prime95 program. It is
useful for stress testing, and is one level harder to pass,
than memtest86+ is. If the Prime95 test stops running, and
reports an error, your RAM has problems.

http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft

Paul

 

[Vic RR Garcia]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

Working as designed, too much a different kind of MOBO, will have to do
a full install.

Note that unless you have Win 7 64 bits, it will not see the extra memory.

 

[G. Morgan]

Working as designed, too much a different kind of MOBO, will have to do
a full install.

Note that unless you have Win 7 64 bits, it will not see the extra memory.

+1

 

[Tinker Tanker]

Test with memtest86+ first. Scroll half way down the page, to find
the download links.

http://www.memtest.org/

The test can handle larger quantities of RAM. A couple complete
passes, on the pass counter, error free, is enough testing.

For a quick test, I test the sticks one at a time. That
saves time, in finding seriously defective products.

Then, combine the freshly tested and error free sticks, in larger
configurations. Try 2x4GB next for example, one stick
in each channel.

Remove those two, and try the other two.

Finally, combine all four.

The case with four, may be affected by bus loading. The BIOS
may attempt to automatically reduce the memory bus speed
one notch. And that is to compensate a bit for the processor
memory controller characteristics.

Also, examine the memory proudct packaging, for a statement
about what Vdimm the product uses, to guarantee error free
operation. If the DIMM uses 1.7V, and you're on an AMD system,
you can go into the BIOS and bump up the voltage to the specified
value. Perhaps by default, the BIOS is using a slightly lower
value.

There are some RAM pseudo-standards, such as XMP, that aid in
memory setup. With a motherboard that doesn't support those
kinds of standards, there is still some work for the user to do.
The user is still ultimately responsible, for setting everything
needed to make the memory work. In fact "Auto", isn't always
enough. With the right kind of "dumb" "extreme" memory, you
may need to do some BIOS work, to get it error free.

*******

This isn't a particularly good technique, but you could connect
an empty disk to your new build, insert the Win7 DVD, do an
install, with the network cable disconnected. See how the install
goes. If the install errors out, chances are some hardware
(like your RAM), is causing it.

Another test I use, is to boot a Linux LiveCD. Download a 64 bit
distro, so that it will make use of all the RAM. If "funny things"
happen to the live boot of such a CD/DVD, then that could again
be indirect evidence of a hardware issue. As a stress test,
you can even run Prime95 from Linux. This site has both
Windows and Linux versions of the Prime95 program. It is
useful for stress testing, and is one level harder to pass,
than memtest86+ is. If the Prime95 test stops running, and
reports an error, your RAM has problems.

http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft

Paul

Thanks for the lengthy contribution !

I always do all install/upgrades strictly off line. As far as I'm
concerned all this "cloud" computing is for data thiefs and idiots who
fall for it.

At least I got to test my RAM and it shows 0 errors on 6 passes. Since
the operational drive is a 2tb one (NOT Advanced Format) I did an
install on a smaller drive just to see. Same problem. Then I pulled 8gb
of RAM out and installed again but this time I installed a 32 bit
version. It took (as it should I think though I know diddley about
windows). Then on a hunch I reinserted the 8gb of RAM and it still
booted. Next I dd'd the install back to the 2tb drive and it still
worked after a "do a repair" reboot.

I think I may have 32/64 bit install DVD's cross labelled, I'll have to
check them against the originals, I did do one run with a 32 bit
original and it bombed but I didn't latch on 'cause I wasn't interested
in that one anyway. I had thought that the previously installed version
was 64 bit but maybe it wasn't, hence the first problems. The long of
the short may be that when I kept trying to reinstall 64 bit I was doing
it with 32 bit copies (thinking them to be 64's) on a now 16gb system.

Does any of this make any sense to anyone who knows anything? How can I
check on an installed system if it's 32 or 64? What I have right now is
an installation and an image that works on a 64 bit system with 16gb of RAM.

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

I think I may have 32/64 bit install DVD's cross labelled, I'll have to check
them against the originals, I did do one run with a 32 bit original and it
bombed but I didn't latch on 'cause I wasn't interested in that one anyway.
I had thought that the previously installed version was 64 bit but maybe it
wasn't, hence the first problems. The long of the short may be that when I
kept trying to reinstall 64 bit I was doing it with 32 bit copies (thinking
them to be 64's) on a now 16gb system.

Does any of this make any sense to anyone who knows anything? How can I check
on an installed system if it's 32 or 64? What I have right now is an
installation and an image that works on a 64 bit system with 16gb of RAM.

Click on the Start Orb, right click on Computer and choose Properties.
Somewhere near the middle of that panel under System, there's a field
called System type.

A 32-bit system should run OK with 16GB, but it won't give you access
to more than 3.5 GB or so.

Also, in the part I clipped, you talked about memory testing. I have
had the experience of memory passing two different testers at several
hours each, yet my computer didn't start running OK until I removed
half of the memory. It wasn't the amount: if I ran sticks 1 & 2 alone
it was OK and if I ran 3 & 4 alone if crashed, regardless of which
slots I used.

BTW, B means bytes and b means bits, normally.

 

[Paul]

Thanks for the lengthy contribution !

I always do all install/upgrades strictly off line. As far as I'm
concerned all this "cloud" computing is for data thiefs and idiots who
fall for it.

At least I got to test my RAM and it shows 0 errors on 6 passes. Since
the operational drive is a 2tb one (NOT Advanced Format) I did an
install on a smaller drive just to see. Same problem. Then I pulled 8gb
of RAM out and installed again but this time I installed a 32 bit
version. It took (as it should I think though I know diddley about
windows). Then on a hunch I reinserted the 8gb of RAM and it still
booted. Next I dd'd the install back to the 2tb drive and it still
worked after a "do a repair" reboot.

I think I may have 32/64 bit install DVD's cross labelled, I'll have to
check them against the originals, I did do one run with a 32 bit
original and it bombed but I didn't latch on 'cause I wasn't interested
in that one anyway. I had thought that the previously installed version
was 64 bit but maybe it wasn't, hence the first problems. The long of
the short may be that when I kept trying to reinstall 64 bit I was doing
it with 32 bit copies (thinking them to be 64's) on a now 16gb system.

Does any of this make any sense to anyone who knows anything? How can I
check on an installed system if it's 32 or 64? What I have right now is
an installation and an image that works on a 64 bit system with 16gb of
RAM.

The second item here, shows how to use the "System" control panel to check
the installed version. What I can't tell you, is if there is a reliable
way to detect version, based solely on directory structure. On a 64 bit
system, there would be two program file folders, one for x86 (32 bit
executable) and one for x64 (64 bit executable). I don't know if
a 32 bit install doesn't bother with that structure or not. (I only
have the one 64 bit install here, so don't have good materials to work with.)

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/32-bit-and-64-bit-Windows-frequently-asked-questions

Paul

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

Tinker Tanker wrote:

The second item here, shows how to use the "System" control panel to check
the installed version. What I can't tell you, is if there is a reliable
way to detect version, based solely on directory structure. On a 64 bit
system, there would be two program file folders, one for x86 (32 bit
executable) and one for x64 (64 bit executable). I don't know if
a 32 bit install doesn't bother with that structure or not. (I only
have the one 64 bit install here, so don't have good materials to work with.)

Paul

The 32-bit Windows only has the one Program Files directory, no (x86)
variant. All the program files get installed by default in Program
Files, unless the publisher chooses a different default, but that's
rare.

 

[Ken Blake]

I just upgraded my mobo to from asus A8N-E to an Crosshair-4 and ram
from 4gb to 16gb. Now the previously installed w7 will no longer boot
and I can't reinstall it either, getting similar hardware problem
messages in both cases, suggesting a restart of the installation & a
repair. That doesn't work either.

You've gotten a number of replies focusing on the RAM you added. But
almost certainly the real issue is the change in motherboards. Such a
change normally requires that you do a clean reinstallation of
Windows.

 

[choro]

Click on the Start Orb, right click on Computer and choose Properties.
Somewhere near the middle of that panel under System, there's a field
called System type.

A 32-bit system should run OK with 16GB, but it won't give you access to
more than 3.5 GB or so.

Also, in the part I clipped, you talked about memory testing. I have had
the experience of memory passing two different testers at several hours
each, yet my computer didn't start running OK until I removed half of
the memory. It wasn't the amount: if I ran sticks 1 & 2 alone it was OK
and if I ran 3 & 4 alone if crashed, regardless of which slots I used.

BTW, B means bytes and b means bits, normally.

It is not normally but by convention! Except where ISP salesmen
pronounced Kbs as KiloBytes until one day I rudely told a salesman NOT
to tell lies. And they always quoted the highest possible download
speeds, the lying bastards, never mentioning that these speeds could go
down dramatically depending your area and time of day.

 

[Char Jackson]

You've gotten a number of replies focusing on the RAM you added. But
almost certainly the real issue is the change in motherboards. Such a
change normally requires that you do a clean reinstallation of
Windows.

I remember skimming this thread the other day and wondering why no one
had pointed out the obvious. (And then I moved on, without doing it
myself.) Thanks to you, the obvious has now been pointed out.

 

[Ken Blake]

I remember skimming this thread the other day and wondering why no one
had pointed out the obvious. (And then I moved on, without doing it
myself.) Thanks to you, the obvious has now been pointed out.

And thank you for the kind words.

 

[Paul]

And thank you for the kind words.

The original post says:

"and I can't reinstall it either"

and that should have covered hardware differences. If the original
post only contained details of "moving" a disk from one set of
hardware to another, perhaps the responses would have been different.
It sounded like the OP had done a little more work than that.

Paul

 

[Thip]

You've gotten a number of replies focusing on the RAM you added. But
almost certainly the real issue is the change in motherboards. Such a
change normally requires that you do a clean reinstallation of
Windows.

With all due respect, I've gone through two complete changes flawlessly
(unfortunately, the motherboards weren't flawless). I've had to remove bits
of leftovers, but the computer booted immediately and installed the
necessary drivers.

 

[Char Jackson]

The original post says:

"and I can't reinstall it either"

and that should have covered hardware differences. If the original
post only contained details of "moving" a disk from one set of
hardware to another, perhaps the responses would have been different.
It sounded like the OP had done a little more work than that.

From the OP's post, I can't tell if he tried a clean install or not.
In fact, now that I've gone back to read the OP again, it's pretty
devoid of details.

 

[Char Jackson]

With all due respect, I've gone through two complete changes flawlessly
(unfortunately, the motherboards weren't flawless). I've had to remove bits
of leftovers, but the computer booted immediately and installed the
necessary drivers.

A lot depends on how different the new mobo is, compared to the
previous board. I've had some success myself, but more often than not
it fails similar to how yours did, so I don't count on it.

 

[R. C. White]

Hi, Tinker.

How can I check on an installed system if it's 32 or 64?

Quickest way I know: Hold down the Windows key while you press the Break
key. The System Properties window will pop up in your face. In the middle
of that screen, as Gene said, will be "System type". If you are running
64-bit Windows, it will say "64-bit Operating System". I haven't run 32-bit
(x86) in so long that I forget what it says, if anything.

The Break key is usually in the upper right area of the keyboard and is
often combined with the Pause key, so you may have to toggle it between
Pause and Break.

And as Paul said, the 32-bit Windows is often referred to as "x86", derived
from the x86 line of 16-bit and 32-bit CPUs from Intel, starting with the
8086, then 80186, 80286, 80386, 80486 - and then Pentium.

Until 64-bit Windows first appeared as Windows XP 64-bit edition in about
2005, Windows had a single Program Files folder - and 32-bit Windows still
has just that one folder. Each 64-bit version of Windows (WinXP, Vista,
Win7) added a second folder for 32-bit apps installed on the 64-bit system;
Microsoft's crackerjack Naming Crew called this new folder "Program Files
(x86)".

A 64-bit app will not run - or even install - in 32-bit Windows, of course,
so all apps in a 32-bit Windows will be installed by default in C:\Program
Files.

But 64-bit Windows can install and run BOTH 32-bit and 64-bit apps. Many of
their DLLs, drivers and other support files depend on the "bitness" of the
operating system. So to keep the apps separated by bitness, all 64-bit apps
get installed by default into Program Files, while 32-bit apps on 64-bit
Windows go into Program Files (x86).

If YOUR C:\ folder has ONLY "C:\Program Files", then you are running 32-bit
Windows (x86). If you ALSO have "C:\Program Files (x86)", then you are
running 64-bit Windows.

As the others also said, 64-bit Windows can use a LOT of RAM, much more than
16 GB. But 32-bit Windows is hardware-constrained to 4 GB. And, because it
must reserve some addresses within that 4 GB space for use by drivers and
other housekeeping, you won't see more than about 3 to 3.5 GB of usable RAM,
even if you have 16 GB or more.

That same System Properties window reached by <Win><Break> will show your
Installed memory (RAM) just above the System type. My Win7 Ultimate x64
says 8.00 GB. What does yours say?

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2011 (Build 15.4.3508.1109) in Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1


"Tinker Tanker" wrote in message

Test with memtest86+ first. Scroll half way down the page, to find
the download links.

http://www.memtest.org/

The test can handle larger quantities of RAM. A couple complete
passes, on the pass counter, error free, is enough testing.

For a quick test, I test the sticks one at a time. That
saves time, in finding seriously defective products.

Then, combine the freshly tested and error free sticks, in larger
configurations. Try 2x4GB next for example, one stick
in each channel.

Remove those two, and try the other two.

Finally, combine all four.

The case with four, may be affected by bus loading. The BIOS
may attempt to automatically reduce the memory bus speed
one notch. And that is to compensate a bit for the processor
memory controller characteristics.

Also, examine the memory proudct packaging, for a statement
about what Vdimm the product uses, to guarantee error free
operation. If the DIMM uses 1.7V, and you're on an AMD system,
you can go into the BIOS and bump up the voltage to the specified
value. Perhaps by default, the BIOS is using a slightly lower
value.

There are some RAM pseudo-standards, such as XMP, that aid in
memory setup. With a motherboard that doesn't support those
kinds of standards, there is still some work for the user to do.
The user is still ultimately responsible, for setting everything
needed to make the memory work. In fact "Auto", isn't always
enough. With the right kind of "dumb" "extreme" memory, you
may need to do some BIOS work, to get it error free.

*******

This isn't a particularly good technique, but you could connect
an empty disk to your new build, insert the Win7 DVD, do an
install, with the network cable disconnected. See how the install
goes. If the install errors out, chances are some hardware
(like your RAM), is causing it.

Another test I use, is to boot a Linux LiveCD. Download a 64 bit
distro, so that it will make use of all the RAM. If "funny things"
happen to the live boot of such a CD/DVD, then that could again
be indirect evidence of a hardware issue. As a stress test,
you can even run Prime95 from Linux. This site has both
Windows and Linux versions of the Prime95 program. It is
useful for stress testing, and is one level harder to pass,
than memtest86+ is. If the Prime95 test stops running, and
reports an error, your RAM has problems.

http://www.mersenne.org/freesoft

Paul

Thanks for the lengthy contribution !

I always do all install/upgrades strictly off line. As far as I'm
concerned all this "cloud" computing is for data thiefs and idiots who
fall for it.

At least I got to test my RAM and it shows 0 errors on 6 passes. Since
the operational drive is a 2tb one (NOT Advanced Format) I did an
install on a smaller drive just to see. Same problem. Then I pulled 8gb
of RAM out and installed again but this time I installed a 32 bit
version. It took (as it should I think though I know diddley about
windows). Then on a hunch I reinserted the 8gb of RAM and it still
booted. Next I dd'd the install back to the 2tb drive and it still
worked after a "do a repair" reboot.

I think I may have 32/64 bit install DVD's cross labelled, I'll have to
check them against the originals, I did do one run with a 32 bit
original and it bombed but I didn't latch on 'cause I wasn't interested
in that one anyway. I had thought that the previously installed version
was 64 bit but maybe it wasn't, hence the first problems. The long of
the short may be that when I kept trying to reinstall 64 bit I was doing
it with 32 bit copies (thinking them to be 64's) on a now 16gb system.

Does any of this make any sense to anyone who knows anything? How can I
check on an installed system if it's 32 or 64? What I have right now is
an installation and an image that works on a 64 bit system with 16gb of RAM.

 

[Tinker Tanker]

The second item here, shows how to use the "System" control panel to check
the installed version. What I can't tell you, is if there is a reliable
way to detect version, based solely on directory structure. On a 64 bit
system, there would be two program file folders, one for x86 (32 bit
executable) and one for x64 (64 bit executable). I don't know if
a 32 bit install doesn't bother with that structure or not. (I only
have the one 64 bit install here, so don't have good materials to work
with.)

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/32-bit-and-64-bit-Windows-frequently-asked-questions


Paul

Thanks.

I did that system lookup and what I have is a 32 bit system. The page
also says that it is 64-bit capabale.

I'm going to answer my own OP to clear up some questions.