Networking Sleeps with Computer


J

JCO

When Windows 7 goes to sleep, all Internet activity stops (by default
apparently). Is there a way to only allow emails to continually receive
while the computer is asleep? If so, how is this done?

Thanks in advance.
 
C

Char Jackson

When Windows 7 goes to sleep, all Internet activity stops (by default
apparently). Is there a way to only allow emails to continually receive
while the computer is asleep? If so, how is this done?

Thanks in advance.
I believe you'll have to wake the computer when you want it to check
for new email. As you discovered, sleep really does mean sleep.

If you describe in more detail what you'd like to accomplish, perhaps
someone can guide you to a programmatic way of waking the computer at
one or more specified times, forcing it to check for new email, then
optionally putting it back to sleep.
 
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V

VanguardLH

JCO said:
When Windows 7 goes to sleep, all Internet activity stops (by default
apparently). Is there a way to only allow emails to continually receive
while the computer is asleep? If so, how is this done?

Thanks in advance.
If you have programs that are active then just why would you think the
computer is sleeping? If you are running an e-mail program that is
polling your accounts, doing video editing, copying files, running AV
scans, and so on then obviously your computer isn't sleeping. It is
working.

Besides, if the computer is sleeping then YOU aren't there using the
computer, are you? So why do you care about new-mail alerts when you
aren't even at the computer? This would be like setting an alarm clock
to go off to wake you up in the morning but the alarm clock is in your
garage instead of next to your bed. It's a superfluous alert because
you aren't there to here or see it.

Sleeping also means the monitor goes to sleep. That means it isn't
displaying anything. So you won't see those e-mail alerts. In fact,
you can separately configure the hard disks and monitor to go into sleep
mode before the computer itself goes into sleep power mode. If the
monitor is off then you won't see those e-mail alerts. If the computer
is sleeping, you aren't there to see the alerts.

Your question doesn't make sense. If you're at the computer then it
isn't sleeping because you are using the computer. If the computer is
sleeping then you've been away from your computer for awhile and you
won't be notified of any alerts, anyway, if the computer weren't even
sleeping.
 
B

Bob

If you have a cell phone with a mobile email app turn on your phone's email
alerts.
 
J

JCO

What I'm trying to say is this. When I walk away from my computer, it will
eventually sleep. When this happens, my outlook no longer polls the Verizon
server. I would prefer for my emails to continue to download while I'm
away. That way, when I get back to my computer, the unread emails are all
waiting to be read. This is how it was with XP. Currently I have to wake
my computer, wait for a few seconds until the network comes back on-line,
then wait for my emails to download from the server via Outlook.
Hope this makes more sense. It might seem silly to some, but I would like
to only allow my Outlook to continue getting all my emails while I'm away
from the computer.
Thanks

"Char Jackson" wrote in message

When Windows 7 goes to sleep, all Internet activity stops (by default
apparently). Is there a way to only allow emails to continually receive
while the computer is asleep? If so, how is this done?

Thanks in advance.
I believe you'll have to wake the computer when you want it to check
for new email. As you discovered, sleep really does mean sleep.

If you describe in more detail what you'd like to accomplish, perhaps
someone can guide you to a programmatic way of waking the computer at
one or more specified times, forcing it to check for new email, then
optionally putting it back to sleep.
 
V

VanguardLH

JCO said:
When I walk away from my computer, it will eventually sleep. When
this happens, my outlook no longer polls the Verizon server. I would
prefer for my emails to continue to download while I'm away. That
way, when I get back to my computer, the unread emails are all
waiting to be read. This is how it was with XP. Currently I have to
wake my computer, wait for a few seconds until the network comes back
on-line, then wait for my emails to download from the server via
Outlook. Hope this makes more sense. It might seem silly to some,
but I would like to only allow my Outlook to continue getting all my
emails while I'm away from the computer.
Apparently you did not have Windows XP going into a sleep mode. For
Outlook or any other e-mail client to function then the computer cannot
be sleeping. If the computer is inuse then it isn't sleeping.

Configuring the power scheme to turn off the monitor and spin-down the
hard disks is NOT putting the computer into sleep mode. Also, sleeping
is NOT the same as reducing the power-duty of the computer (by reducing
CPU cycles allocated to threads). We can only assume what you mean by
"sleep" but what you think it is might not be really a sleep power mode.
 
J

JCO

So, without beating up on me as before, what about my issue and is there a
solution?
Is there a way for my computer (Windows 7) to continually allow Outlook to
download my emails while I'm away.

"VanguardLH" wrote in message
When I walk away from my computer, it will eventually sleep. When
this happens, my outlook no longer polls the Verizon server. I would
prefer for my emails to continue to download while I'm away. That
way, when I get back to my computer, the unread emails are all
waiting to be read. This is how it was with XP. Currently I have to
wake my computer, wait for a few seconds until the network comes back
on-line, then wait for my emails to download from the server via
Outlook. Hope this makes more sense. It might seem silly to some,
but I would like to only allow my Outlook to continue getting all my
emails while I'm away from the computer.
Apparently you did not have Windows XP going into a sleep mode. For
Outlook or any other e-mail client to function then the computer cannot
be sleeping. If the computer is inuse then it isn't sleeping.

Configuring the power scheme to turn off the monitor and spin-down the
hard disks is NOT putting the computer into sleep mode. Also, sleeping
is NOT the same as reducing the power-duty of the computer (by reducing
CPU cycles allocated to threads). We can only assume what you mean by
"sleep" but what you think it is might not be really a sleep power mode.
 
V

VanguardLH

JCO said:
So, without beating up on me as before, what about my issue and is there a
solution?
Is there a way for my computer (Windows 7) to continually allow Outlook to
download my emails while I'm away.
Sure. Don't put your computer into a sleep power mode. If you want
applications to run when you are away then you need to let the computer
keep running those programs.

If you want to save on energy, and as I clued to you before, configure
your power options to power off the monitor and spin-down the hard
disks. That does NOT require going into a sleep mode. Create your own
power plan or modify an existing one. You can also determine just how
productive is your host by tweaking the processor power management
settings in your power plan.
 
P

Paul

JCO said:
So, without beating up on me as before, what about my issue and is there
a solution?
Is there a way for my computer (Windows 7) to continually allow Outlook
to download my emails while I'm away.
I think the operating principle here, is the computer is
going to do what it feels like :) It's hard to tame
the damn things, when it comes to power policy...

In terms of system states, these are some examples.

S1 - turn off monitor, but CPU keeps cranking.
S3 - turn off monitor, suspend to RAM, stop computing, no email coming in
S4 - turn off monitor, hibernate by writing RAM contents to disk, then switch
off, stop computing, no email coming in

The user interfaces, don't usually refer to them that way,
so the labels aren't helping really.

You can see in my example, there is only one state besides
S0, that remains completely responsive. And turning off a
modern LCD monitor, isn't as much of a power saver, as
in previous years, turning off a CRT monitor. S1 used to
save a couple hundred watts, if it would cause the CRT
to turn off completely.

If you set the computer, to wake up at a defined time, and
carry out a defined task, then you may arrange to get your
email updated.

The thing is, even in S1, it may be possible for the computer to

1) Run the CPU in a lower power state, without affecting the ability
to check your mail.
2) Spin down the hard drives, when they aren't active. Every time
your email check happens, the disks will spin up again. Is that
good for the drives ? It depends on the polling interval, and
whether the disk spindown time is set short enough, that the disks
spin down between mail checks.

I think my computer might use about 60 watts if it sat in S1
and checked my email all night. It uses maybe 5 watts if I
put it in S3 sleep (+5VSB rail), but then, my email won't be
up-to-date when I hit the return key at 8:00 AM. To save even
more power, I'd have to use S4 Hibernate, and use the switch on
the back of the computer to remove all power.

If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.

*******

If I look in the Power Options control panel, there are options
in there you can use. You can set the monitor to turn off, but
set the machine to remain running. The "Advanced" button, brings
up even more options, for fine tuning. You wouldn't have
to play with the "Sleep" and "Hibernate" timers, as you're not
planning on Sleeping (S3) or Hibernating (S4). You're going to
turn of the monitor, but otherwise, leave things running (S1).

It is also possible, for the computer to save power on individual
interfaces. Whether that will cause a problem with your email
thing, may depend on how some of the other hardware is set up.
For example, if I go to Device Manager (devmgmt.msc) and select
my Marvell wired Ethernet port, doing a Properties on that and
looking at the Power Management tab shows:

Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power.

Normally, having that box ticked, wouldn't do anything of significance.
But, a day is coming, where the networking devices (ADSL modem, cable
modem, wired/wireless router box), may interpret a sleeping network
interface on the computer, as an excuse to break the connection to
the ISP to save power. So there are some other, potential tiny issues,
that could arise, and the settings can't be immediately found in
the Power Options control panel. Some people run into those options,
when they're trying to set up Wake On LAN (WOL), which is a way
of remotely waking a computer, by sending a Magic Packet. Some
people operate serving devices, which they wake remotely in that
way. And then the state of the "Allow the computer..." setting
is more important. (The remote computer can't "hear you", if the
network port was put to sleep.) A person setting that up, may need
to pay more attention to the LAN chip settings.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake_on_lan

So not every setting you could possibly want, is in Power Options,
but a good many of them are.

Paul
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.
I am not a rocket scientist, but I am also not most people. Whatever, I
can get scheduled tasks to work. I guess what I am is *persistent* :)

I was going to suggest to JCO that he set up a task to wake the computer
from sleep, check mail, and go back to sleep. However, it should be set
up to run only when the computer is in sleep mode[1], and that is the
problem - I can't find a setting in Task Scheduler to do that. So I
didn't reply with that idea.

But now I thought I'd mention it anyway, in case there's a rocket
scientist reading this who can solve that problem :)

One idea is to run the task from a batch or VBScript file which will
exit without any action unless the computer is in sleep mode, and put
the back-to-sleep command in that file. Maybe Nirsoft has a command to
test sleep mode...Or maybe even Windows cmd or VBScript does.

I'll leave those things as an exercise to the reader. I've done enough
already :)

[1] If it ran in awake mode, it would still put the computer to sleep
when finished. That would definitely be enough to PO the Good Humor Man.
 
B

Bob I

If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.
I am not a rocket scientist, but I am also not most people. Whatever, I
can get scheduled tasks to work. I guess what I am is *persistent* :)

I was going to suggest to JCO that he set up a task to wake the computer
from sleep, check mail, and go back to sleep. However, it should be set
up to run only when the computer is in sleep mode[1], and that is the
problem - I can't find a setting in Task Scheduler to do that. So I
didn't reply with that idea.

But now I thought I'd mention it anyway, in case there's a rocket
scientist reading this who can solve that problem :)

One idea is to run the task from a batch or VBScript file which will
exit without any action unless the computer is in sleep mode, and put
the back-to-sleep command in that file. Maybe Nirsoft has a command to
test sleep mode...Or maybe even Windows cmd or VBScript does.

I'll leave those things as an exercise to the reader. I've done enough
already :)

[1] If it ran in awake mode, it would still put the computer to sleep
when finished. That would definitely be enough to PO the Good Humor Man.
I suppose one could set the task to fire off e-mail send/receive every 5
or 10 min. and set it to wake to perform the task. On the other hand
just killing the monitor and hard drive would take care of most of the
energy use.
 
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J

JCO

Okay I will look that over.. thanks
But I'm confused about one thing. If I spin down the HD, will Outlook
download emails. Seems that it would store those in the .pst file
(database) therefore, requiring the HD to be active.

"VanguardLH" wrote in message
So, without beating up on me as before, what about my issue and is there a
solution?
Is there a way for my computer (Windows 7) to continually allow Outlook to
download my emails while I'm away.
Sure. Don't put your computer into a sleep power mode. If you want
applications to run when you are away then you need to let the computer
keep running those programs.

If you want to save on energy, and as I clued to you before, configure
your power options to power off the monitor and spin-down the hard
disks. That does NOT require going into a sleep mode. Create your own
power plan or modify an existing one. You can also determine just how
productive is your host by tweaking the processor power management
settings in your power plan.
 
J

JCO

Thanks.. that makes sense


"Paul" wrote in message
So, without beating up on me as before, what about my issue and is there a
solution?
Is there a way for my computer (Windows 7) to continually allow Outlook to
download my emails while I'm away.
I think the operating principle here, is the computer is
going to do what it feels like :) It's hard to tame
the damn things, when it comes to power policy...

In terms of system states, these are some examples.

S1 - turn off monitor, but CPU keeps cranking.
S3 - turn off monitor, suspend to RAM, stop computing, no email coming in
S4 - turn off monitor, hibernate by writing RAM contents to disk, then
switch
off, stop computing, no email coming in

The user interfaces, don't usually refer to them that way,
so the labels aren't helping really.

You can see in my example, there is only one state besides
S0, that remains completely responsive. And turning off a
modern LCD monitor, isn't as much of a power saver, as
in previous years, turning off a CRT monitor. S1 used to
save a couple hundred watts, if it would cause the CRT
to turn off completely.

If you set the computer, to wake up at a defined time, and
carry out a defined task, then you may arrange to get your
email updated.

The thing is, even in S1, it may be possible for the computer to

1) Run the CPU in a lower power state, without affecting the ability
to check your mail.
2) Spin down the hard drives, when they aren't active. Every time
your email check happens, the disks will spin up again. Is that
good for the drives ? It depends on the polling interval, and
whether the disk spindown time is set short enough, that the disks
spin down between mail checks.

I think my computer might use about 60 watts if it sat in S1
and checked my email all night. It uses maybe 5 watts if I
put it in S3 sleep (+5VSB rail), but then, my email won't be
up-to-date when I hit the return key at 8:00 AM. To save even
more power, I'd have to use S4 Hibernate, and use the switch on
the back of the computer to remove all power.

If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.

*******

If I look in the Power Options control panel, there are options
in there you can use. You can set the monitor to turn off, but
set the machine to remain running. The "Advanced" button, brings
up even more options, for fine tuning. You wouldn't have
to play with the "Sleep" and "Hibernate" timers, as you're not
planning on Sleeping (S3) or Hibernating (S4). You're going to
turn of the monitor, but otherwise, leave things running (S1).

It is also possible, for the computer to save power on individual
interfaces. Whether that will cause a problem with your email
thing, may depend on how some of the other hardware is set up.
For example, if I go to Device Manager (devmgmt.msc) and select
my Marvell wired Ethernet port, doing a Properties on that and
looking at the Power Management tab shows:

Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power.

Normally, having that box ticked, wouldn't do anything of significance.
But, a day is coming, where the networking devices (ADSL modem, cable
modem, wired/wireless router box), may interpret a sleeping network
interface on the computer, as an excuse to break the connection to
the ISP to save power. So there are some other, potential tiny issues,
that could arise, and the settings can't be immediately found in
the Power Options control panel. Some people run into those options,
when they're trying to set up Wake On LAN (WOL), which is a way
of remotely waking a computer, by sending a Magic Packet. Some
people operate serving devices, which they wake remotely in that
way. And then the state of the "Allow the computer..." setting
is more important. (The remote computer can't "hear you", if the
network port was put to sleep.) A person setting that up, may need
to pay more attention to the LAN chip settings.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wake_on_lan

So not every setting you could possibly want, is in Power Options,
but a good many of them are.

Paul
 
J

JCO

That is interesting but I don't want to complicate things or make too much
out of this.
However, working off of your thoughts..... It seems that I should be able to
force the computer to come out of sleep when there is LAN activity (email).
But spinning the drive down and back on 30 times a day would eat more energy
than if I simply kept the computer running the whole time. Nice thought
though.

"Gene E. Bloch" wrote in message

If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.
I am not a rocket scientist, but I am also not most people. Whatever, I
can get scheduled tasks to work. I guess what I am is *persistent* :)

I was going to suggest to JCO that he set up a task to wake the computer
from sleep, check mail, and go back to sleep. However, it should be set
up to run only when the computer is in sleep mode[1], and that is the
problem - I can't find a setting in Task Scheduler to do that. So I
didn't reply with that idea.

But now I thought I'd mention it anyway, in case there's a rocket
scientist reading this who can solve that problem :)

One idea is to run the task from a batch or VBScript file which will
exit without any action unless the computer is in sleep mode, and put
the back-to-sleep command in that file. Maybe Nirsoft has a command to
test sleep mode...Or maybe even Windows cmd or VBScript does.

I'll leave those things as an exercise to the reader. I've done enough
already :)

[1] If it ran in awake mode, it would still put the computer to sleep
when finished. That would definitely be enough to PO the Good Humor Man.
 
J

JCO

Understood

"Bob I" wrote in message


If you set up a Scheduled Task, at perhaps 7:30 AM, to wake the
computer, and if Outlook was left running, maybe that would
achieve the desired result (have mail waiting when you hit the
return key on the keyboard at 8:00 AM). But if past experience
is any metric, most people run into problems getting
Scheduled Tasks to work. I don't use them, and I suspect
you have to be a Rocket Scientist to get them to work.
I am not a rocket scientist, but I am also not most people. Whatever, I
can get scheduled tasks to work. I guess what I am is *persistent* :)

I was going to suggest to JCO that he set up a task to wake the computer
from sleep, check mail, and go back to sleep. However, it should be set
up to run only when the computer is in sleep mode[1], and that is the
problem - I can't find a setting in Task Scheduler to do that. So I
didn't reply with that idea.

But now I thought I'd mention it anyway, in case there's a rocket
scientist reading this who can solve that problem :)

One idea is to run the task from a batch or VBScript file which will
exit without any action unless the computer is in sleep mode, and put
the back-to-sleep command in that file. Maybe Nirsoft has a command to
test sleep mode...Or maybe even Windows cmd or VBScript does.

I'll leave those things as an exercise to the reader. I've done enough
already :)

[1] If it ran in awake mode, it would still put the computer to sleep
when finished. That would definitely be enough to PO the Good Humor Man.
I suppose one could set the task to fire off e-mail send/receive every 5
or 10 min. and set it to wake to perform the task. On the other hand
just killing the monitor and hard drive would take care of most of the
energy use.
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

But I'm confused about one thing. If I spin down the HD, will Outlook
download emails. Seems that it would store those in the .pst file
(database) therefore, requiring the HD to be active.
The drive spins up automatically when needed.
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

That is interesting but I don't want to complicate things or make too much
out of this.
However, working off of your thoughts..... It seems that I should be able to
force the computer to come out of sleep when there is LAN activity (email).
But spinning the drive down and back on 30 times a day would eat more energy
than if I simply kept the computer running the whole time. Nice thought
though.
The arrival of e-mail is initiated by a request from the computer. There
is no incoming network activity until the e-mail program requests
e-mail.

Unless you're doing something I've never heard of...

This is all pretty silly anyway. When you return to your sleeping
computer, you could just wake it up and wait for the e-mail to arrive,
rather than having it arrive while you're in downtown Detroit.
 
J

JCO

Yes that is why I said earlier that I did not want to make a big deal about
this. I simply was hoping there was an easy configuration that allowed
emails to continue. That goes for Skype too. If someone was to call me on
Skype and my computer is asleep, I would not hear it. Skype will show me
online only while I'm actively working on the computer.

Thanks for your input.

"Gene E. Bloch" wrote in message

That is interesting but I don't want to complicate things or make too much
out of this.
However, working off of your thoughts..... It seems that I should be able
to
force the computer to come out of sleep when there is LAN activity
(email).
But spinning the drive down and back on 30 times a day would eat more
energy
than if I simply kept the computer running the whole time. Nice thought
though.
The arrival of e-mail is initiated by a request from the computer. There
is no incoming network activity until the e-mail program requests
e-mail.

Unless you're doing something I've never heard of...

This is all pretty silly anyway. When you return to your sleeping
computer, you could just wake it up and wait for the e-mail to arrive,
rather than having it arrive while you're in downtown Detroit.
 
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V

VanguardLH

JCO said:
If I spin down the HD, will Outlook download emails. Seems that it
would store those in the .pst file (database) therefore, requiring
the HD to be active.
Anytime any process attempts to read or write a file to the spun-down
hard disk will have it spin-up again. The hard disk's logic interface
doesn't go into sleep mode. It's still fully awake. In fact, you'll
find most laptops are configured to have their hard disks spin down
after awhile to save on battery power. That doesn't stop from using
those hard disks.
 
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