No email on W-7

R

RH Breener

Char Jackson said:
I see that as a Good Thing, and hopefully one day you'll be able to
look back at this time and agree.
I worked with Thunderbird today and dislike it as much as the last time I
tried it. I wasted hours today looking through the helpfiles, and never
found the information I was looking for. I don't see this as a good thing.
It wont work for usenet, that's for sure.
 
J

John Williamson

R. H. Breener said:
OK, I already went through the helpfiles and couldn't find the answer as
to where the button for "get more headers" or something similar was
hidden. So all I get is 300 at a time and can't download more. I didn't
find the expand thread button either nor a way to remove the wide
horizontal band across the message pane with Sender and Subject etc.
Didn't find the spellchecker, the size of the messages downloaded and
couldn't trim excess text from a post I tried to reply to.
When you open a newsgroup with new posts, a dialog box should appear
asking you if you wish to download a configurable number of headers and
mark other messages as read or all headers, assuming that there are more
than the configured number of unread posts. If you want to download new
headers while a group is being read, then File>get mail will check for
new posts (in that group only), or TB can be set to check all groups for
new mail at any interval you wish, and will automatically show the
results. If you click on the - sign next to the server name in the left
hand pane, this will collapse the list of groups. If you then click on
the + sign by the server name, this will expand the list of groups,
showing the number of new posts in each thread. There is also a tick box
in the in the dialogue box to stop it asking you again. This behaviour
can be modified in the account settings dialogue that you can open in
the right hand pane after clicking on the server name in the left hand pane.

To expand a thread, click on the + sign at the left hand end of the
thread title in the top pane.

To remove the wide band showing the thread details in later versions of
Thunderbird, you need to download a plugin, which can then easily be set
to show as much or as little of the header information as you wish. The
"View" menu is worth exploring and experimenting with.

The spellchecker is another free plugin which is available for many
languages. I have six installed, all of which can be called up on demand
or automatically.

When you are replying to a post, all the normal Windows editing controls
and methods work. Highlight the unwanted text and delete by using the
right click menu or pressing the delete key are the ways I have been
doing it for the last fifteen years.

There's probably a way to chack message sizes, by downloading a plugin,
but as I don't care about such things, I've never needed to know it
since I was on the internet using a 9600Baud cellular modem where I had
to pay by the second for downloads.

All this is clearly and simply explained in the help. RTFM. HTH.
What you may not see as a problem, someone else does. And some luck out
and get software with no problems at all.
*No* software is without problems. Some simple software is easy to use
up to a point, but can't do complicated stuff easily if at all.
Thunderbird is, in my experience, easy to use and can be configured to
act and look exactly as I want an e-mail program and news reader to act.
It takes me a few minutes to set up a dozen accounts on three servers on
a new computer, all with their contents stored in *my* preferred
locations and a couple of news accounts, again with the messages and
settings stored whgere *I* want them. It's even quicker if I use the
backup and restore facilities available to all Mozilla users.

For instance, those who have trouble understanding and using computers,
may Eldy handy:-

http://www.eldy.eu/

Will replace the Windows desktop and provide simple, easy to use mail
and browsing facilities. It *can* be configured to an extent, but it is
intended to be set up by a skilled administrator, and then locked down
so the user can't change anything that matters.
 
R

R. H. Breener

John Williamson said:
What won't it do on usenet that you want it to?
OK, I already went through the helpfiles and couldn't find the answer as to
where the button for "get more headers" or something similar was hidden. So
all I get is 300 at a time and can't download more. I didn't find the
expand thread button either nor a way to remove the wide horizontal band
across the message pane with Sender and Subject etc. Didn't find the
spellchecker, the size of the messages downloaded and couldn't trim excess
text from a post I tried to reply to.
I've been using it to access usenet since it first came out with no
problems, as have many others.
What you may not see as a problem, someone else does. And some luck out and
get software with no problems at all.
 
R

R. H. Breener

Tim Slattery said:
NSP = News Service Provider?

When I post a message, my newsreader contacts Eternal September's
Usenet server at the address they gave me when I set up the account.
It logs in using the password/UID they gave me. Then it passes the
message to the server and it does what it does with it. Email has
*nothing* to do with this transaction. I think there's an assumption
that your email address is in the "From" header, but it's not checked.
We learn something every day. As I said earlier, I just never gave it much
thought.
 
C

Char Jackson

That way, you don't assault your recipients with huge-sized

That would apply to businesses, not people with PCs at home, for home use.
Actually, it applies to home users primarily.
Yeah, what's with this ribbon bar anyway? It's just more crap to dig
through and around to use the program.
Rather than trying to dig through or around it, you could try just
using it. I know that sounds bizarre and extreme, but in some amount
of time (minutes? hours?) you'll become quite familiar with it and
it'll no longer be something to dig through or go around. Just a
suggestion.
 
C

Char Jackson

I've had no problem sending some pretty large files to people through email.
And that's the problem, that it's too easy to send huge files via
email. Email isn't really designed for large file transfers, but the
other thing is that people have stopped caring about their recipients.
Just attach and let them fly, I guess. Let the recipient(s) deal with
it.

Personally, I'd much rather receive a *link* via email so that I can
choose whether I want to visit, and if so, what I want to download.
 
C

Char Jackson

I worked with Thunderbird today and dislike it as much as the last time I
tried it. I wasted hours today looking through the helpfiles, and never
found the information I was looking for. I don't see this as a good thing.
It wont work for usenet, that's for sure.
TB works fine for Usenet. See what I mean about missing the basics?
 
V

VanguardLH

Char said:
Megaupload has been in the news recently. They've been shut down.
Details at <http://www.megaupload.com/>.
Looks like Spread-It also changed (in not letting you upload any file
you want there to make accessible to others). I just gave a sampling of
free online file storage services. A Google search would find even more
of them, as in:

http://www.google.com/search?q=free+online+file+storage

Currently I use aDrive because of its large disk quota (50 GB storage,
2GB per file). I find my ISP's personal web page disk quota of 25 GB
(already included in my account there) also handy to distribute files
rather than bloat my e-mails.
 
V

VanguardLH

RH said:
VanguardLH wrote ...


No, but who cares? How many people are using Skydrive? I never even
heard of it before you just mentioned it. No one I know ever
mentioned it.
That new features aren't important to YOU doesn't obviate that there are
new features in WLM that are *not* available in WM or OE. There was
improvement (change) but it wasn't anything you cared about.

You might be using MS Word or MS Exchange and they have had improvement
with successive versions and you may have upgraded but it is very likely
there is a lot of those product's features that you don't use so you
don't care about them. There are lots of features in those products
that I don't know about or haven't heard about - until I need to use
them. I'm pretty sure a lot of software you installed has features you
don't know about or don't use so you don't care about them. That
doesn't preclude them from improvement over successive versions.

That "WLM is no improvement over WM" was the issue that I addressed, not
whether you know of the improvements, like them, or use them.
That would apply to businesses, not people with PCs at home, for home
use.
Oh, you really would appreciate everyone you know and don't know that
sends you e-mails to attach 20 GB of attachments to them? You don't
care that senders create e-mails to you that consume lots of bandwidth
to download them, consume your disk quota at your e-mail account,
consume local disk space in the message store for whatever e-mail client
you happen to use, and for attachments you may not even want to see?

Remember why you started this discussion?
Why would the average person need all those features? If they were so
popular people wouldn't be trying to get WM to work on W7.
Why do people get MS Word when they often employ less than a third of
all its features? That someone wants to use an old e-mail client has to
do with their familiarity with that program. It's what they understand,
what they've used, and what they want to continue using. There are
still users of the old crappy FreeAgent newsreader or using Grabit for
discussions which is good at yanking binaries but sucks for discussions.

Just because you don't want a feature or don't use it has no bearing on
what other users want. You're claiming your narrow wants are those of
the majority of other users. Neither you nor I have those statistics to
prove what the "typical user" wants out of WLM. That features exist
within a product that you don't want doesn't mean you have to use them
but they are there.
I know that since there are three gmail accounts on there now, and
they work. One keeps getting the password-rejected error and I've
reinstalled the info several times now. I don't think lack of
familiarity is causing old deleted emails from last year to keep
downloading. I hope it stops because there is no way to delete more
than 3 at a time despite what someone wrote here. And they delete
very slowly.
Need to take those troubles to the WLM newsgroup where its users can
address those issues.

microsoft.public.windows.live.mail.desktop

I suspect some of the suggestions there would be to delete the account
in WLM (not just edit the old one) and recreate a new account that
specifies the problematic Gmail account, disable your anti-virus
software or anything else that interrogates your e-mail traffic, and ask
you to describe what happens when you attempt to select more than 3
messages at a time in WLM.

So how many e-mails are sitting in your Inbox folder when you log into
your Gmail account using their webmail client? Thousands of them? If
so, also mention that to the WLM newsgroup.
how do I get the email to download CLOSED until I click on them to
open them? Closed like in WM so I can delete them quickly or in a
group? They download already OPEN and on or two take up the whole
pane.
If you download an e-mail, your choice may be (depending on the
abilities of the e-mail client) to obtain only the headers or the entire
message (headers + body). If you "download" the e-mail, I have to
assume you download the entire message. It doesn't matter whether you
"open" it or not. That you downloaded it means you got the whole thing.
It's already there in your e-mail client's message store. The bandwidth
already got consumed to retrieve the entire message. Only if you use a
rule (or option in some e-mail clients) to check for a message's size
BEFORE downloading it (so you only get its headers) is how you limit how
much you download. In that case, all you have are the headers. You'll
still have to download the entire message if you want to see its body.

A downloaded e-mail isn't "opened" until you select it. If you don't
want a default message pre-selected in the Preview pane then don't use
the Preview pane. Close the Preview pane and thereafter double-click on
a message that you want to open (but which has already been downloaded
in its entirety). If you use the rule to block the download of e-mails
that exceed the specified maximum size then all you get are the headers.

It looks like what you want WLM to do is not to "open" (preview) an
e-mail when it is selected. That means *not* using WLM's preview pane
(aka reading pane). The same was also true for WM and OE.
 
X

XS11E

RH Breener said:
Which ones are good in your opinion?
I use Pegasus Mail for email and Xnews for Usenet.
Pegasus = http://www.pmail.com/downloads_s3_t.htm

There's a very good support forum on the website.

Xnews = http://xnews.newsguy.com

Any questions can be answered at news.software.readers

Some suggestions:

Pegasus:
Install it into it's own folder rather than the default.

XDownload the "latest version" and install it in it's OWN FOLDER, NOT
the default. Then, get the "test" version and just drop the executible
file into your Xnews folder to update. Why? Because the 'test'
version is the latest but it's the .exe file only, the older "latest"
version has the installation files. The author, Luu Tran has his own
really weird naming system.

http://twovoyagers.com/blinkynet.net/comp/xnewsrels.html

NOTE: I keep Xnews AND Pmail on a separate partition, that way I can
format drive C:, install a later OS and have my email and news back by
just creating shortcuts in the new OS.
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

And that's the problem, that it's too easy to send huge files via
email. Email isn't really designed for large file transfers, but the
other thing is that people have stopped caring about their recipients.
Just attach and let them fly, I guess. Let the recipient(s) deal with
it.

Personally, I'd much rather receive a *link* via email so that I can
choose whether I want to visit, and if so, what I want to download.
It amazes me how hard it is to convince some of my correspondents to do
that :-(

There's one in particular that has trained me not to open his e-mails on
my smartphone.

At least it shows that I am still trainable :)
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

Thanks, we're in full agreement.
Actually, this part of the thread is kind of fun for me.

There seem to be several people who actually agree with each other and
yet get on each other's cases.

Me included :)

So it kind of keeps me smiling wryly.
 
C

Char Jackson

It amazes me how hard it is to convince some of my correspondents to do
that :-(

There's one in particular that has trained me not to open his e-mails on
my smartphone.
My active correspondents are pretty good about it, thankfully. I
mentioned it a couple of times, but didn't beat them up, so maybe
someone else also mentioned it and the cumulative effect was enough.

Another training opportunity came regarding forwarding emails with
multiple recipients in the To header. I don't want my email address
out there, being forwarded hither and yon, (I'm told that it's yon you
have to worry about; hither isn't that bad), so I did a bit of brow
beating to get everyone to use BCC. That was 2-3 years ago and so far,
so good.
At least it shows that I am still trainable :)
That usually comes with being married.
 
K

Ken Blake

There seem to be several people who actually agree with each other and
yet get on each other's cases.

Me included :)

So it kind of keeps me smiling wryly.

I'm glad you're not riling, Smiley. <g>
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

I'm glad you're not riling, Smiley. <g>
I really was drinking coffee!

Luckily, I had swallowed the current sip before I saw your post.

Biggest (and fortunately the driest) laugh of the day so far...
 
K

Ken Blake

I really was drinking coffee!

Luckily, I had swallowed the current sip before I saw your post.

Biggest (and fortunately the driest) laugh of the day so far...

Glad you liked it! ;-)
 
B

Bob Hatch

They're about the same. I never had a problem with either of them. I
can't say that about some of the others I've tried over the years.
Thunderbird doesn't have a way that I can see or find to get the next
300 Usnet messages to download
Tools>Account Settings>Server Settings Check the box "Ask me before
downloading more than {enter your number here} messages.

- there is no "get next headers" button
that I could find.
Get Mail Button

When I tried to reply to someone, did not allow me
to delete some of their text.
High light and click delete, or use the back space key, or use the
delete key, or highlight the text you want to keep and press the left
curve arrow button on the reading pane.

So I still have no working email/news
software on the new W7 computer.
That's your fault, not Thunderbirds.
Which would you recommend that's fast and easy to set up and easy to
use? Something like OE or WM. Not the new over-bloated WLM, as that's
the pits. I'm having problems with Thunderbird and some people really
like that software.

--
I do not carry a gun hoping that
I'll be able to shoot someone, anymore than
I carry a jack hoping I'll have a flat
tire.
Me.
 
R

R. H. Breener

Bob Hatch said:
Tools>Account Settings>Server Settings Check the box "Ask me before
downloading more than {enter your number here} messages.

- there is no "get next headers" button

Get Mail Button

When I tried to reply to someone, did not allow me

High light and click delete, or use the back space key, or use the delete
key, or highlight the text you want to keep and press the left curve arrow
button on the reading pane.

So I still have no working email/news

That's your fault, not Thunderbirds.
This will help w/Thunderbird. So far I got WM to open and work in W7.
Oddly enought it's OE and not the WM that's on Vista. That's fine with me.
 
R

R. H. Breener

XS11E said:
I use Pegasus Mail for email and Xnews for Usenet.
Pegasus = http://www.pmail.com/downloads_s3_t.htm

There's a very good support forum on the website.

Xnews = http://xnews.newsguy.com

Any questions can be answered at news.software.readers

Some suggestions:

Pegasus:
Install it into it's own folder rather than the default.

XDownload the "latest version" and install it in it's OWN FOLDER, NOT
the default. Then, get the "test" version and just drop the executible
file into your Xnews folder to update. Why? Because the 'test'
version is the latest but it's the .exe file only, the older "latest"
version has the installation files. The author, Luu Tran has his own
really weird naming system.

http://twovoyagers.com/blinkynet.net/comp/xnewsrels.html

NOTE: I keep Xnews AND Pmail on a separate partition, that way I can
format drive C:, install a later OS and have my email and news back by
just creating shortcuts in the new OS.
Thank you for this information. In case WM doesn't keep working on W7 I'll
start checking them out.
 

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