Advantages of Windows 8?

[Gene Wirchenko]

[snip]

If you're paying attention to what you're doing, (and I'm sure you
are), you'll most likely become more efficient over time. You'll
develop new muscle memory.

Starting over again is not efficient. If I need to do something
different because of changing requirements in my area, it is one
thing. Having to do it because Microsoft (or whoever) decided to
change things for no good reason is quite another.

[snip]

You kind of loaded the question when you characterized the changes as
gratuitous, no?

Well, why does Microsoft keep moving things around? It does not
strike me as at all necessary. Besides, if the move were really
necessary, then it would not be gratuitous, and I would not mind (or
not so much). I am not opposed to sensible change. Senseless change,
OTOH, I do not like.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

 

[Gene E. Bloch]

If you had read the post that you snipped, you'd have seen that
Windows still calls it as I mentioned above. I described how you can
see that for yourself. I don't really care what the top of the window
says after the applet has launched.

You finally pushed me over the edge

I went to the Start Orb, typed add rem, and saw a highlighted entry that
said add or remove programs. Clicking on it took me to a panel labeled
Uninstall or change a program. It even had a subtitle explaining
(briefly) how to use it.

Call this a +1.

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Char Jackson:

If you're paying attention to what you're doing, (and I'm sure you
are), you'll most likely become more efficient over time. You'll
develop new muscle memory.

Granted.

But it takes time: man hours... and man hours = dollars.

The question begged is "Why should 13,000 employees spend those
man hours if there is no functional gain to be had over the way
it was before?"

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per J. P. Gilliver (John):

There's a difference between "thinking of everything" and "letting users
continue to find things where they're used to finding them". It seems to
be a deliberate decision not to do the latter. (Not just at Microsoft,
though I'd say they're by far the worst offenders.)

I wonder if Gates' turning over the helm to others has anything
to do with this?

One of the initial strengths, IMHO, of Windows was the
consistency of the UI across applications and I'm guessing that
Gates was behind that. At one time, I even had a developer
standard from MS that told me where to put stuff, what to call
it, and how various types of buttons should act.

More-and-more I'm seeing applications where that UI is
increasingly abandoned - including Microsoft apps.

I cannot cite off the top of my head, but I'm even seeing apps
where there isn't even a 'File' menu - or any of the other
conventional menus. The functionality is there, but it is
buried beneath different icons depending on the app.

 

[Char Jackson]

Per Char Jackson:

Granted.

But it takes time: man hours... and man hours = dollars.

The question begged is "Why should 13,000 employees spend those
man hours if there is no functional gain to be had over the way
it was before?"

If you're asking me to explain Microsoft's design choices and then
defend them, I can't. I wasn't present in the design meetings where
this stuff was discussed. Gene W says the changes were gratuitous and
you say they provided no functional gain. Both suggestions are
probably wrong, but I can't tell you why. There's a slim chance that
it's just change for the sake of change, but that seems unlikely.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

Per J. P. Gilliver (John):

I wonder if Gates' turning over the helm to others has anything
to do with this?

I doubt it. Windows 3.1's File Manager was replaced by W9x's Windows
Explorer, despite serving the same purpose. (OK, it did much more, but
why change the name?) And another one from that transition: why move the
close function to right next to the maximise and minimise functions,
thus significantly increasing the chance of hitting it by mistake? That
transition was I think still under Bill. (I actually rather like Bill.)
[]

More-and-more I'm seeing applications where that UI is
increasingly abandoned - including Microsoft apps.

I cannot cite off the top of my head, but I'm even seeing apps
where there isn't even a 'File' menu - or any of the other
conventional menus. The functionality is there, but it is
buried beneath different icons depending on the app.

The default in Vista and 7 is for the menus not to be visible anyway,
isn't it?
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than
to those attending too small a degree of it. -Thomas Jefferson, 3rd US
president, architect and author (1743-1826)

 

[Char Jackson]

You finally pushed me over the edge

I don't like the sound of that, and to be honest, reading it scared me
a little at first.

I went to the Start Orb, typed add rem, and saw a highlighted entry that
said add or remove programs. Clicking on it took me to a panel labeled
Uninstall or change a program. It even had a subtitle explaining
(briefly) how to use it.

Call this a +1.

Thanks.

 

[Char Jackson]

[snip]

If you're paying attention to what you're doing, (and I'm sure you
are), you'll most likely become more efficient over time. You'll
develop new muscle memory.

Starting over again is not efficient. If I need to do something
different because of changing requirements in my area, it is one
thing. Having to do it because Microsoft (or whoever) decided to
change things for no good reason is quite another.

I take "for no good reason" to mean you don't know the reason, and not
that Microsoft didn't have a reason. For all we know, they had an
excellent reason. We weren't there.

Note that I support your right to be cranky about changes from one OS
to another. The thing I'm complaining about is that you and I don't
know enough to be able to call those changes gratuitous or for no good
reason.

Well, why does Microsoft keep moving things around? It does not
strike me as at all necessary. Besides, if the move were really
necessary, then it would not be gratuitous, and I would not mind (or
not so much). I am not opposed to sensible change. Senseless change,
OTOH, I do not like.

So since we don't know the reasons for the changes that have been
bothering you, do you concur that calling them gratuitous is
premature? For all we know, they may not be gratuitous at all.

 

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

In message <[email protected]>, Char Jackson

I take "for no good reason" to mean you don't know the reason, and not
that Microsoft didn't have a reason. For all we know, they had an
excellent reason. We weren't there.

Note that I support your right to be cranky about changes from one OS
to another. The thing I'm complaining about is that you and I don't
know enough to be able to call those changes gratuitous or for no good
reason. []

not so much). I am not opposed to sensible change. Senseless change,
OTOH, I do not like.

So since we don't know the reasons for the changes that have been
bothering you, do you concur that calling them gratuitous is
premature? For all we know, they may not be gratuitous at all.

How long do we have to wait for the explanations/reasons to be given?
Or, in some cases, the reasons may have been given but we do not accept
that they _are_ good reasons.

 

[Char Jackson]

In message <[email protected]>, Char Jackson

I take "for no good reason" to mean you don't know the reason, and not
that Microsoft didn't have a reason. For all we know, they had an
excellent reason. We weren't there.

Note that I support your right to be cranky about changes from one OS
to another. The thing I'm complaining about is that you and I don't
know enough to be able to call those changes gratuitous or for no good
reason. []

not so much). I am not opposed to sensible change. Senseless change,
OTOH, I do not like.

So since we don't know the reasons for the changes that have been
bothering you, do you concur that calling them gratuitous is
premature? For all we know, they may not be gratuitous at all.

How long do we have to wait for the explanations/reasons to be given?
Or, in some cases, the reasons may have been given but we do not accept
that they _are_ good reasons.

What makes you think the information you seek will EVER be released?
As consumers, we certainly have no right to it, nor do we have an
expectation that it will someday be provided. Or at least I don't.

 

[Tony]

From what i remember people automatically liked windows xp because you could leave your
computer on for days at a time. Winodws 98SE always had to be rebooted once or twice a day.

When a new OS is released, people always hate it but in time they get
used to it and come to like it more than previous OS's. For example,
when XP was first released, people hated it and kept using Windows 98SE
and Windows NT 4. Now it seems they can't live without XP!!! Even
Windows 7 was hated by many and now they love it.

--
Good Guy
Website: http://mytaxsite.co.uk
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Forums: http://mytaxsite.boardhost.com
Email: http://mytaxsite.co.uk/contact-us

--
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG

Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city

Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know proper manners

Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs but got fired the first day on the job for
potty mouth,

Bur-ring, i'll get this one: WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM JERK!!? We're here to help you dickweed,
ok, ok give the power cord the jiggily piggily wiggily all the while pushing the power
button repeatedly now take everything out of your computer except the power supply and
*one* stick of ram. Ok get the next sucker on the phone.

Deirdre Straughan (Roxio) is a LIAR (Deirdre McFibber)

There's the employer and the employee and the FROGGER and the FROGEE, which one are you?

Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!

El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar (I just got EL-FROG-OED!!)

All hail Chuckcar the CZAR!! Or in F-R-O-Gland Chuckcar laCZAR, ChuckCZAR!!

I hate them both, With useless bogus bullshit you need at least *three* fulltime jobs to
afford either one of them

I'm a fulltime text *only* man on usenet now. The rest of the world downloads the binary
files not me i can't afford thousands of dollars a month

VBB = Volume based billing. How many bytes can we shove down your throat and out your arse
sir?

The only "fix" for the CellPig modem is a sledgehammer.

UBB = User based bullFROGGING

Master Juba was a black man imitating a white man imitating a black man

Always do incremental backups of your data or you'll end up like the A-Holes at DSL
Reports. Justin says i made a boo-boo. Yeah boo-who.

Updates are for idiots. As long as the thing works there's no reason to turn
schizophrenic and develop a lifelong complex over such a silly issue.

Adrian "jackpot" Lewis is a mama's boy!

Jimmy Fricke is good for the game of poker

Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions beyond the realm of
understandability

Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday

This sig file was compiled via my journeys through usenet

 

[DJT]

Judging from my experience with the Previews... I can see no advantage
at all over Windows 7, and some disadvantage due to it's new,
unfriendly, and inappropriate interface changes.

I hate to say that, because I do think Windows interface has improved
in most ways with each iteration. But Windows 8 seemeth to stink, yea
verily.

I have loaded the preview of Win 8 and I cannot find anything, when I
try to do anything.

My wife would not put up with the changes to the interface so there is
no way we will be going to Win 8. ( She is not even interested in
ipgarding from Office 2003 to 2010 as it would involve to much
change).
I will be getting a new PC later this year, will not be getting Win 8
on it.

This version I think will go the way of Vista( which I didn't mind,
but Win 7 was better).

Microsoft will need to make the mobile phone interface optional before
I will use it.

DJT

 

[Gene Wirchenko]

If you're asking me to explain Microsoft's design choices and then
defend them, I can't. I wasn't present in the design meetings where
this stuff was discussed. Gene W says the changes were gratuitous and
you say they provided no functional gain. Both suggestions are
probably wrong, but I can't tell you why. There's a slim chance that
it's just change for the sake of change, but that seems unlikely.

It seem to me that if it was done for a good reason, then it
would be fairly obvious.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

 

[mechanic]

If you had read the post that you snipped, you'd have seen that
Windows still calls it as I mentioned above. I described how you
can see that for yourself. I don't really care what the top of
the window says after the applet has launched.

I don't know whether you're just being awkward for the sake of it,
but if you open Control Panel in W7 you won't find "Add or Remove
Programs" but you will find that functionality under "Programs and
Features". What's so hard about that?

 

[mechanic]

Microsoft will need to make the mobile phone interface optional
before I will use it.

Don't panic, if you just disregard it, it seems to get out of the
way.

 

[John Williamson]

On 03/07/2012 05:18, Gene Wirchenko wrote:

It seem to me that if it was done for a good reason, then it
would be fairly obvious.

There's a possibility that the interface design team or their management
has changed, and this is the way the new lot prefer doing things.

 

[Char Jackson]

I don't know whether you're just being awkward for the sake of it,
but if you open Control Panel in W7 you won't find "Add or Remove
Programs" but you will find that functionality under "Programs and
Features". What's so hard about that?

Are you intentionally not reading the posts that you reply to?

I didn't say a word about Control Panel. Not a word.

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per Char Jackson:

There's a slim chance that
it's just change for the sake of change, but that seems unlikely.

I would agree with that 100%.

 

[Char Jackson]

It seem to me that if it was done for a good reason, then it
would be fairly obvious.

I might agree if you were part of the design team that made the
decisions, but it's clear to me that you weren't in the room, (and
neither was I), so there is no reason to assume that the design
choices should be obvious to you.

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per mechanic:

I don't know whether you're just being awkward for the sake of it,
but if you open Control Panel in W7 you won't find "Add or Remove
Programs" but you will find that functionality under "Programs and
Features". What's so hard about that?

Hard about which? Understanding that it's different in W7 or
finding the new location?

If it's the second, I'd say it's not particularly hard at all -
but takes a few minutes.

Bit a few minutes multiplied by 10,000+ employees, multiplied by
some number of similar situations adds up.