I just want a simple wired broadbad connection!

[DanS]

Yeah, they told me I had to wait till next Thurday.
I drove down to their office today and got a new modem.

None of which had anything to do with your problems with Windows 7.

Then I managed to get tier 3 support on the phone and
activate the modem remotely.
I'd love to dump the tv and just have the internet. I only
watch 2 channels. I hate u.s. television and it's even
worse now with the election coming up.

So do it. Drop cable TV and only buy internet.

 

[Char Jackson]

I've got it fixed. New modem,

You said the XP machine worked. Ergo, it wasn't a modem issue.

kill Ipv6.

Not required.

Solved 80% of the problem.
Idiot 7 Home machine still acting up.

"Acting up" isn't descriptive enough to guide the next troubleshooting
steps.

 

[DanS]

I'd try going around the router with a win7 machine, see
if it works
straight from the modem. If it does then it's a modem/win7
problem.

If tha tis tried, it won't work w/o rebooting the modem, then booting the PC, and the rtr's
MAC is associated with the modem until the modem in rebooted.

 

[Char Jackson]

So do it. Drop cable TV and only buy internet.

If TW is like Comcast, and I suspect it is, then Internet and TV are
cheaper than Internet alone.

 

[spottbunny]

<cable> --- modem --- router --- computer #1
--- computer #2
--- computer #3
---

I would start by reviewing what WinXP is doing with its connection.

I can describe a scenario which would account for the symptoms, but
it would only fit for an ADSL broadband connection. If you put an
ADSL modem in "bridged" mode, virtually all other networking functions
in the modem/router box are disabled. Even though there is a switch
to provide the four wired ports, in that case it speaks PPPOE. The
WinXP machine, could detect this, and start running PPPOE itself. But
PPPOE is not a "multi-user" protocol, so once WinXP machine starts
talking PPPOE, the other 3 wired ports will appear dead.

I don't know if there is an equivalent setting for a cable modem/router
box. Namely, to disable the router portion.

I suspect the solution, is actually an issue with the modem/router.

I've got every thing mostly fixed with a new cable modem.
I was trying to set up a new Vonage adapter and the cable modem and
network got TRASHED!
This was weird: I could access the interet on the XP machine but I could
no longer access the router's set up page on the XP machine. I couldn't
access the internet with either Windows 7 machine but I could access the
router's set up page.
I tried connecting all the PC's directly to the modem individually. The
Windows 7 machines could not connect. I could always get on with the XP
machine no matter how I had the router set up.

 

[spottbunny]

I'd try going around the router with a win7 machine, see if it works
straight from the modem. If it does then it's a modem/win7 problem.

No, It didn't work with the windows 7 machine connected directly to the
modem.
Problem is mostly fixed now. Thanks.

 

[Char Jackson]

I've got every thing mostly fixed with a new cable modem.

You would have accomplished the same thing by rebooting your existing
cable modem rather than replacing it. There was nothing wrong with the
one you had since you said one computer worked fine with it.

I was trying to set up a new Vonage adapter and the cable modem and
network got TRASHED!

I'm familiar with two kinds of Vonage adapters. One simply plugs into
a LAN port on your router and is incapable of "trashing" your network.
The other type of adapter is actually a router and expects to be
inserted between your cable modem and the rest of your home network.
Likewise, that won't trash your network.

This was weird: I could access the interet on the XP machine but I could
no longer access the router's set up page on the XP machine. I couldn't
access the internet with either Windows 7 machine but I could access the
router's set up page.

Almost certainly sounds like you have the WAN cable plugged into a LAN
port by mistake. The symptoms fit perfectly. Check the Ethernet cable
that connects the cable modem to the router to be sure the router end
is connected to the WAN port and not a LAN port. Reboot the cable
modem and allow it to stabilize, reboot the router and allow it to
stabilize, and finally, reboot the PC's. Everything should "just
work".

I tried connecting all the PC's directly to the modem individually. The
Windows 7 machines could not connect. I could always get on with the XP
machine no matter how I had the router set up.

That will be the case if you forgot to reboot the cable modem every
time you connected a different PC. The cable modem will only talk to
the first device it sees after it reboots.

 

[Char Jackson]

No, It didn't work with the windows 7 machine connected directly to the
modem.

Did you remember to reboot the cable modem after connecting a
different PC directly to it? If you forgot, it's correct behavior that
it didn't work.

Problem is mostly fixed now. Thanks.

"Mostly fixed", "acting up", "fighting"...can you be any less
technical?

 

[Char Jackson]

I'd always used the XP machine for that. I'm on that page frequently
because I forward ports.
After the meltdown I could no longer access that page on the xp machine.
I could get to it on the 7 machines which couldn't access the internet.

That's a sign that the XP machine had a "public" IP address, rather
than a private address, which is further indication that you have the
cable modem's WAN cable connected to a LAN port on the router.

 

[spottbunny]

None of which had anything to do with your problems with Windows 7.

snip

It had plenty to do with Windows 7. I got on immediatly with XP. I had
to shut down IPv6 to get the 7 Pro machine back on and re-install a
router for the 7 home machine. Windows 7 keep spewing out meaningless
error codes about dial up or wireless connections, neither of which I
have.
snip

So do it. Drop cable TV and only buy internet.

snip
I don't pay for the cable.

 

[spottbunny]

You said the XP machine worked. Ergo, it wasn't a modem issue.


Not required.


"Acting up" isn't descriptive enough to guide the next troubleshooting
steps.

That's my husband's machine and I'm afraid to mess with it any more.
If it goes down again I'll be back.

 

[spottbunny]

You would have accomplished the same thing by rebooting your existing
cable modem rather than replacing it. There was nothing wrong with the
one you had since you said one computer worked fine with it.


I'm familiar with two kinds of Vonage adapters. One simply plugs into
a LAN port on your router and is incapable of "trashing" your network.
The other type of adapter is actually a router and expects to be
inserted between your cable modem and the rest of your home network.
Likewise, that won't trash your network.


Almost certainly sounds like you have the WAN cable plugged into a LAN
port by mistake. The symptoms fit perfectly. Check the Ethernet cable
that connects the cable modem to the router to be sure the router end
is connected to the WAN port and not a LAN port. Reboot the cable
modem and allow it to stabilize, reboot the router and allow it to
stabilize, and finally, reboot the PC's. Everything should "just
work".


That will be the case if you forgot to reboot the cable modem every
time you connected a different PC. The cable modem will only talk to
the first device it sees after it reboots.

Thanks for the help.
If you plugged a cable into the wrong port would that damage your
hardware?
The cable modem was very flaky after it encountered the Vonage device,
which happened to be of the Lan variety. Very strange that my network
which had been operating beautifly for several years had a complete melt
down after it arrived.
The modem with the xp machine could access the internet but needed to
reboot every 20 minutes or so. I had to use the factory reset button on
the modem to get it to do that much.

I would not have believed this could happend had I not seen it first
hand. What a night mare.

 

[VanguardLH]

Looks like you are using dynamic IP addressing for the router and your
intranet hosts. That means the upstream DHCP server *must* be present
BEFORE you have the downstream host bind to (ask for) an IP address.

For your intranet hosts, they are the downstream nodes in your network
as they are likely configured to use DHCP to get dynamically assigned IP
addresses. To them, the upstream DHCP server built into the router.

For your router, its upstream DHCP server is your ISP's DHCP server
(through the cable modem).

For DHCP to work means the upstream DHCP server must already be running
and accessible to the downstream host. To get a dynamic IP address
assigned to a host means its upstream DHCP must be ready to dole one
out. If the upstream DHCP server is not available, from where is the
downstream host going to request an IP address? If a host cannot find
its upstream DHCP server, it will fallback and assign a private IP
address called APIPA (automatic private IP addressing) but which is not
usable for networking past the router. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apipa
http://compnetworking.about.com/cs/protocolsdhcp/g/bldef_apipa.htm

If I see an intranet host with a 169.x.x.x APIPA address then I know the
host couldn't find its upstream DHCP server at the time it tried to
bind. If I see the router has an 169.x.x.x APIPA address then I know
the ISP's DHCP server wasn't available at the time the router tried to
create a binding. In those cases, and if the upstread DHCP servers were
available, the problem was binding in the wrong order (bottom-up instead
of top-down). APIPA addresses cannot get past the network segment in
which they are defined hence they cannot be used to get past the router
out to the Internet.

Unlike the 2nd article indicates, I'm not auto-renegotiation is
guaranteed. That is, when the upstream DHCP server becomes available
doesn't mean your host is going to then initiate a renegotiation with
the DHCP server to get an IP address that is usable outside the network
segment. I've had to do a release and renew to release the old binding
and force a new binding.

To avoid APIPA addressing and to ensure the upstream DHCP server is
already available when you bring up a host that wants an IP binding, you
power up in top-down order, not bottom-up, as in:

- Power it all down: cable modem, router, and all intranet hosts.
- Power up only the cable modem and let it stabilize (takes about a
minute).
- Then power up the router and let it stabilize. It will now get its
dynamically assigned IP address from your ISP (because their DHCP
server is already ready).
- Lastly power up each intranet host. It will get its dynamically
assigned IP address from your router's built-in DHCP server.

For a host to get (bind to) a dynamically assigned IP address means its
DHCP server has to already be available. It looks like you've been
yanking and plugging cables without the proper power cycling sequence or
binding in the proper order or forcing a rebind. This isn't like
plugging in audio cables. Binding requires negotiation and that means
the DHCP server has to be ready so it can handle a request from the
client. Doing a release (unbind) and renew still requires doing them in
proper order although sometimes it will work out of order.

The above doesn't apply if you configure the TCP/IP properties on your
intranet hosts to use static IP addresses. Then they don't need to have
an already running DHCP server from which to get one; however, that also
means you have to configure which DNS server(s) you will use to resolve
hostnames into IP addresses (humans like names whereas computers always
address each other using numbers). Yet even with static IP address, it
is likely you have not paid or do not get a static IP address from your
ISP (for use by the WAN-side of your router). That means even if you
use static IP addresses for your intranet hosts that you will still need
to use dynamic IP addressing by your router to assign its WAN-side IP
address (the IP address that all sites to which you connect will see).
If you have paid (or get one free with your service) for a static IP
address from your ISP then you need to make sure your router is also
configured to *not* use DHCP to get its IP address and instead you punch
into its config screens the static IP address that your ISP assigned to
you.

If you leave the cable modem, router, and intranet hosts all powered up
and they stay powered up when you go yanking and plugging in CAT5
cables, the current binding in the intranet hosts may no longer be
valid. You need to force a rebind. Power cycling a host is one way to
force a new bind. Another is to run "ipconfig /release *" (release all
bindings) followed by "ipconfig /renew" (to create a new binding). Yet
I've seen TCP/IP setup get screwed up somehow that the command doesn't
work yet a power cycle (in proper order as noted above) will work.
Although binding have an expiration, I've seen routers that have an old
dynamic IP address that the ISP's DHCP server no longer permits to
connect into and through their network. They do some maintainence, your
old IP address (on the WAN-side of the router) is no longer valid, the
router doesn't renegotiate, and the ISP has expired that old binding so
it won't permit its use. You can network between your intranet hosts
but not out from the router because your ISP doesn't think you own that
old IP address anymore. In that case, there usually is a IP reset
function somewhere in the router's config screens. It might be called
Reset or have the 2 separate release and renew functions mentioned for
the ipconfig command (but runs within the router). I have encountered
many times when Internet access stops because the router's WAN-side IP
address previously assigned by my ISP's DHCP server is no longer valid
but the router doesn't renegotiate (or the ISP's DHCP wouldn't do it).
The cure was to go to the router's config screen where it lets me click
on Release (to unbind) and Renew (to bind by asking the ISP's DHCP
server for a new assignment).

It's possible to figure out at which point the binding is no longer
valid but often it is easier and quicker to simply power it all down and
then power up in top-down order: cable modem, router, then host(s).

 

[VanguardLH]

That's a sign that the XP machine had a "public" IP address, rather
than a private address, which is further indication that you have the
cable modem's WAN cable connected to a LAN port on the router.

As per Char's suspicion, tell us what router you have. You have not yet
identified it. Knowing which brand and model of router you have will
those from who you seek help from knowing how this router works (by
online searching for its manual and reading it).

Also note that you never stated that some host-router-modem
configuration worked before. From what you've said so far, it appears
this is your first network setup using a router with multiple hosts. It
looks like you either aren't using the router correctly (Char's
suspicion) or you aren't binding IP addresses in the proper order (see
my other reply (to your reply to Andy Burns' first reply).

Some routers have "WAN" or "UPSTREAM" printed next to a port. THAT is
the one on the router you connect to the cable modem. So far, and
because no one yet know what router you have, most of us or maybe all of
use probably assumed "wired" meant you are using CAT5 cables between
hosts and router and between router and cable modem. If you're using a
USB connection then you'll have to be more detailed what are the
physical connections to the router and cable modem.

There's also the possibility the router is screwed up. You mentioned
going into it to reconfigure port forwarding. You may have made other
changes that you don't want. If the problem is with binding or using
the wrong ports on the router, have you yet tried resetting the router?

 

[VanguardLH]

The cable modem was very flaky after it encountered the Vonage device,
which happened to be of the Lan variety. Very strange that my network
which had been operating beautifly for several years had a complete melt
down after it arrived.
The modem with the xp machine could access the internet but needed to
reboot every 20 minutes or so. I had to use the factory reset button on
the modem to get it to do that much.

A Vonage device ... and what is that? Model number? How it is
connected to your router (which ports on the Vonage "device" to which
ports on the router)?

Could be the Vonage "device" is just a cable modem. Could be it's a
combo device that incorporates both a cable modem and a router. If so,
and with with your other router, you are chaining 2 routers together
instead of using just using the one router in the combo device. Again,
knowing WHAT you have is important to know what is its proper
configuration.

 

[Char Jackson]

Thanks for the help.
If you plugged a cable into the wrong port would that damage your
hardware?

No, it just won't work right until you get the cables straightened
out.

The cable modem was very flaky after it encountered the Vonage device,
which happened to be of the Lan variety. Very strange that my network
which had been operating beautifly for several years had a complete melt
down after it arrived.

I'm sorry, but without specific error messages and test results, your
report of a melt down is basically meaningless. My guess is that it's
about a 98-99% chance of user error.

The modem with the xp machine could access the internet but needed to
reboot every 20 minutes or so. I had to use the factory reset button on
the modem to get it to do that much.

I would not have believed this could happend had I not seen it first
hand. What a night mare.

If you believe it happened, you're one step ahead of me. ;-)

 

[Char Jackson]

That's my husband's machine and I'm afraid to mess with it any more.
If it goes down again I'll be back.

What I've learned here, I guess, is that "acting up" is at least one
step above "goes down". Neither term is technical enough to be
actionable, however. Good luck.

 

[Ken1943]

A Vonage device ... and what is that? Model number? How it is
connected to your router (which ports on the Vonage "device" to which
ports on the router)?

Could be the Vonage "device" is just a cable modem. Could be it's a
combo device that incorporates both a cable modem and a router. If so,
and with with your other router, you are chaining 2 routers together
instead of using just using the one router in the combo device. Again,
knowing WHAT you have is important to know what is its proper
configuration.

Sorry to jump in. Vonage is a voip modem. It can do routing if you use
the lan port on it, but normally just plugged into a lan port on your
router and it connects to the Vonage server. Plug and play.

Make sure you have the correct jack connected to your router.


KenW

 

[Char Jackson]

snip
I don't pay for the cable.

Now you sound like a troll.

 

[Chris S.]

What I've learned here, I guess, is that "acting up" is at least one
step above "goes down". Neither term is technical enough to be
actionable, however. Good luck.

Is Valery back?

Chris