Upgrade to Win8 question - 32 v 64 bit


A

Ashton Crusher

I know I won't be able to resist the $50 upgrade to win8. I'm
currently running Win7 32bit. On more occasions then I would like my
RAM is pretty much filled and I can tell the computer is swapping
stuff in and out of the pagefile. Since I'm maxed out of usable RAM
with the 32 bit version I'm thinking that when I upgrade I should go
to the 64 bit version of Win8. Does that seem like a good idea? Am I
likely to find a bunch of program incompatibilities?
 
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T

Tim Slattery

Ashton Crusher said:
I know I won't be able to resist the $50 upgrade to win8. I'm
currently running Win7 32bit. On more occasions then I would like my
RAM is pretty much filled and I can tell the computer is swapping
stuff in and out of the pagefile. Since I'm maxed out of usable RAM
with the 32 bit version I'm thinking that when I upgrade I should go
to the 64 bit version of Win8. Does that seem like a good idea? Am I
likely to find a bunch of program incompatibilities?
Its' a very good idea, except that there's no upgrade path. You'll
have to install the 64-bit version fresh, then reinstall all your
apps. (At least if MS follows previous practice.)

Oh yes...you'd also have to be sure that your hardware is 64-bit.
 
P

Paul

Ashton said:
I know I won't be able to resist the $50 upgrade to win8. I'm
currently running Win7 32bit. On more occasions then I would like my
RAM is pretty much filled and I can tell the computer is swapping
stuff in and out of the pagefile. Since I'm maxed out of usable RAM
with the 32 bit version I'm thinking that when I upgrade I should go
to the 64 bit version of Win8. Does that seem like a good idea? Am I
likely to find a bunch of program incompatibilities?
Why don't you use the freely downloadable test version of Windows 8
and try it for yourself.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/download

Product Key: TK8TP-9JN6P-7X7WW-RFFTV-B7QPF

(Good until some time in January next year...)

Note - try to use a separate disk while testing, and disconnect your
other disks. This is a safety precaution, to prevent one OS operation
(like System Restore), from possibly affecting any other OSes present.

If you don't want to waste a DVD on that, the download can also
be transferred to a USB key, using a tool from microsoftstore.

Windows 8 actually changes how it uses RAM. I ran an early version
(Developer Preview) of Windows 8, in a VM, in as little as 128MB of
RAM. The OS can be stuffed into a smaller container than some of
the previous OSes.

You may find the RAM isn't quite as filled. I actually
haven't done any testing in that regard, on the latest
version, to see if it is still improved (as bloat can
happen at any time when an OS is being designed).

You can test both the 32 bit and the 64 bit versions if
you want, and see how they behave.

The 64 bit version needs a 64 bit capable processor. That
is likely a relatively modern "P4 or better" processor. Another
dependency noticed on the last release of Windows 8 preview,
is the inclusion of "NX" No Execute in the BIOS. A few people
were denied an installation because of that (not supported
in their hardware). Which is why, running a test copy now, is a
good idea. For example, I learned only a couple days ago, my second
best computer here (Core2 2.6GHz) has no video driver, and Windows 8
is stuck at 1024x768 resolution. And Nvidia has no plan to fix that.
To run Windows 8 on my second-best computer, I'll need a new video
card.

Finally, for some "icing to stick on the cake", you can run this
to give yourself a menu-based OS.

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/features.html

Paul
 
K

Ken1943

Why don't you use the freely downloadable test version of Windows 8
and try it for yourself.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/download

Product Key: TK8TP-9JN6P-7X7WW-RFFTV-B7QPF

(Good until some time in January next year...)

Note - try to use a separate disk while testing, and disconnect your
other disks. This is a safety precaution, to prevent one OS operation
(like System Restore), from possibly affecting any other OSes present.

If you don't want to waste a DVD on that, the download can also
be transferred to a USB key, using a tool from microsoftstore.

Windows 8 actually changes how it uses RAM. I ran an early version
(Developer Preview) of Windows 8, in a VM, in as little as 128MB of
RAM. The OS can be stuffed into a smaller container than some of
the previous OSes.

You may find the RAM isn't quite as filled. I actually
haven't done any testing in that regard, on the latest
version, to see if it is still improved (as bloat can
happen at any time when an OS is being designed).

You can test both the 32 bit and the 64 bit versions if
you want, and see how they behave.

The 64 bit version needs a 64 bit capable processor. That
is likely a relatively modern "P4 or better" processor. Another
dependency noticed on the last release of Windows 8 preview,
is the inclusion of "NX" No Execute in the BIOS. A few people
were denied an installation because of that (not supported
in their hardware). Which is why, running a test copy now, is a
good idea. For example, I learned only a couple days ago, my second
best computer here (Core2 2.6GHz) has no video driver, and Windows 8
is stuck at 1024x768 resolution. And Nvidia has no plan to fix that.
To run Windows 8 on my second-best computer, I'll need a new video
card.

Finally, for some "icing to stick on the cake", you can run this
to give yourself a menu-based OS.

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/features.html

Paul
If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.


KenW
 
P

Paul

Ken1943 said:
If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.


KenW
That's why you don an asbestos suit, before playing with fire.

Use a separate disk, and you won't be sorry.

It's real easy to get rid of, when it's on its own disk and defenseless.

If you're doing a clever "multi-boot" thing, then have fun cleaning
up the mess later. (I know some people enjoy doing that, and
it's no problem for them. And the Windows 7 repair stuff is
pretty clever.) I prefer not having to learn how to do that.

*******

An alternative plan is to ask the question:

"Do you do backups ?"

If you own an external USB hard drive (or even, buy a
USB disk enclosure and put your own bare drive inside it),
then that's a place to store backups.

Windows 7 has the "System Image" function. It will back
up one or more partitions on your main drive.

You put the backup image, on the external USB hard drive.
Then, do a "Safely Remove", power off and disconnect the USB
cable to keep it safe.

Now, you can do experiments with your computer if you want.

During the System Image process, it will ask you if you
want to burn a recovery CD. If you had a Dell/HP/Acer type
computer, and didn't have an installer DVD, you'd say "yes"
and prepare a boot CD when prompted. The boot CD makes
it possible, when your Windows 7 is broken, to copy the
files stored on the external USB drive, back to your main
system drive. That's called "bare metal recovery", and allows
you to escape from a mess you've made. I've used that a few
times, when experiments had unexpected outcomes :)

Paul
 
K

Ken1943

That's why you don an asbestos suit, before playing with fire.

Use a separate disk, and you won't be sorry.

It's real easy to get rid of, when it's on its own disk and defenseless.

If you're doing a clever "multi-boot" thing, then have fun cleaning
up the mess later. (I know some people enjoy doing that, and
it's no problem for them. And the Windows 7 repair stuff is
pretty clever.) I prefer not having to learn how to do that.

*******

An alternative plan is to ask the question:

"Do you do backups ?"

If you own an external USB hard drive (or even, buy a
USB disk enclosure and put your own bare drive inside it),
then that's a place to store backups.

Windows 7 has the "System Image" function. It will back
up one or more partitions on your main drive.

You put the backup image, on the external USB hard drive.
Then, do a "Safely Remove", power off and disconnect the USB
cable to keep it safe.

Now, you can do experiments with your computer if you want.

During the System Image process, it will ask you if you
want to burn a recovery CD. If you had a Dell/HP/Acer type
computer, and didn't have an installer DVD, you'd say "yes"
and prepare a boot CD when prompted. The boot CD makes
it possible, when your Windows 7 is broken, to copy the
files stored on the external USB drive, back to your main
system drive. That's called "bare metal recovery", and allows
you to escape from a mess you've made. I've used that a few
times, when experiments had unexpected outcomes :)

Paul
Just looked it up. If you install win 8 preview and want to go back, you
have to use a restore image.

I don't think my mobo's will have win 8 drivers and I really don't like
my desktop looking like a smart phone which I don't have and will never
get. Too old for that 'new' stuff. LOL


KenW
 
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W

...winston

One click to the Win7 like desktop in Win8, similar toolbar (but more
featured/functional) and still capable of adding the Quick Launch Toolbar.

If you can run Win7, you most likely can run Win8 since Win8 is quite
capable of providing drivers for Win7 mobos (unless your mobo is quite
old)....software applications, printer drivers are a different animal.

--
....winston
msft mvp mail


"Ken1943" wrote in message
Just looked it up. If you install win 8 preview and want to go back, you
have to use a restore image.

I don't think my mobo's will have win 8 drivers and I really don't like
my desktop looking like a smart phone which I don't have and will never
get. Too old for that 'new' stuff. LOL


KenW
 
A

Ashton Crusher

Why don't you use the freely downloadable test version of Windows 8
and try it for yourself.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-8/download

Product Key: TK8TP-9JN6P-7X7WW-RFFTV-B7QPF

(Good until some time in January next year...)

Note - try to use a separate disk while testing, and disconnect your
other disks. This is a safety precaution, to prevent one OS operation
(like System Restore), from possibly affecting any other OSes present.

If you don't want to waste a DVD on that, the download can also
be transferred to a USB key, using a tool from microsoftstore.

Windows 8 actually changes how it uses RAM. I ran an early version
(Developer Preview) of Windows 8, in a VM, in as little as 128MB of
RAM. The OS can be stuffed into a smaller container than some of
the previous OSes.

You may find the RAM isn't quite as filled. I actually
haven't done any testing in that regard, on the latest
version, to see if it is still improved (as bloat can
happen at any time when an OS is being designed).

You can test both the 32 bit and the 64 bit versions if
you want, and see how they behave.

The 64 bit version needs a 64 bit capable processor. That
is likely a relatively modern "P4 or better" processor. Another
dependency noticed on the last release of Windows 8 preview,
is the inclusion of "NX" No Execute in the BIOS. A few people
were denied an installation because of that (not supported
in their hardware). Which is why, running a test copy now, is a
good idea. For example, I learned only a couple days ago, my second
best computer here (Core2 2.6GHz) has no video driver, and Windows 8
is stuck at 1024x768 resolution. And Nvidia has no plan to fix that.
To run Windows 8 on my second-best computer, I'll need a new video
card.

Finally, for some "icing to stick on the cake", you can run this
to give yourself a menu-based OS.

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/features.html

Paul
I'm sure my system would support it but It sounds like I ought to just
do a 32 bit upgrade and see how that works out. Then I can do a new
install of 64bit if I decide to take the plunge - I've got plenty of
extra hard drives I can experiment on.
 
P

Paul

Ken1943 said:
Just looked it up. If you install win 8 preview and want to go back, you
have to use a restore image.

I don't think my mobo's will have win 8 drivers and I really don't like
my desktop looking like a smart phone which I don't have and will never
get. Too old for that 'new' stuff. LOL


KenW
That's fixed for you. Install Windows 8, then install this.

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/features.html

I tried that the other day, and it looks like a nice piece of work.
You get menus, just like a desktop would have.

The only thing wrong with Windows 8 on my second-best computer, is
my video card is too old.

On my primary machine, Windows 8 had all the drivers necessary.

I don't see a reason to be overly concerned about drivers. Yes,
there's stuff that's busted, just like with any OS introduction,
but each OS, they get a bit better at the drivers. Especially if
they can reuse a Vista or Windows 7 driver on Windows 8. My FX5200
video card is just too old for that. It does meet the requirements
for Aero, so they could have done a driver for it, but instead,
the cutoff is 6200 on Nvidia. That's the "lowest card on the
totem pole" at the moment, and the FX5200 is one rung below that.
And I have three of those cards.

Give it a try anyway. The only reason to not try the Windows 8
download, is if you're on dialup :)

Paul
 
M

milt

I know I won't be able to resist the $50 upgrade to win8. I'm
currently running Win7 32bit. On more occasions then I would like my
RAM is pretty much filled and I can tell the computer is swapping
stuff in and out of the pagefile. Since I'm maxed out of usable RAM
with the 32 bit version I'm thinking that when I upgrade I should go
to the 64 bit version of Win8. Does that seem like a good idea? Am I
likely to find a bunch of program incompatibilities?
The better idea would be to stick with Win7 :)
 
T

Tom Lake

"If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.


No problem at all if you install it in a different partition or separate
physical hard drive.
On some of my machines, I run it in VirtualBox and can just delete it if I
want.

Tom Lake
 
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C

Char Jackson

"If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.


No problem at all if you install it in a different partition or separate
physical hard drive.
On some of my machines, I run it in VirtualBox and can just delete it if I
want.
That first paragraph was said by someone else, not by you, Tom. I
encourage you to follow the most basic Usenet conventions, including
proper quoting and giving credit (attribution) to the person who is
being quoted, like I've done with you above.
 
W

...winston

"Ken1943" wrote in message
"If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.

"Tom Lake" wrote in message No problem at all if you install it in a different partition or separate
physical hard drive.
On some of my machines, I run it in VirtualBox and can just delete it if I
want.
A virtual machine makes removal of Win8 (CP or RP) a lot easier.

Even with a different partition or separate hard drive, it is important to
note in a dual operating system environment (e.g. dual boot) the Win8 boot
loader GUI will supplant the previous o/s boot loader. If Win8 is removed,
it may necessitate a Windows repair (via Windows CD/DVD)...optionally one
can use a third party tool to reset/repair the boot files (on the System
partition).
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Char Jackson said:
That first paragraph was said by someone else, not by you, Tom. I
encourage you to follow the most basic Usenet conventions, including
proper quoting and giving credit (attribution) to the person who is
being quoted, like I've done with you above.
He's posting with Windows Live Mail version 15, which doesn't know about
inserting ">"s. I have seen claims that
http://www.dusko-lolic.from.hr/wlmquote/ fixes it (like OE-quotefix did
for Outlook Express) for those that want to keep using it, but I don't
know.
 
C

Char Jackson

He's posting with Windows Live Mail version 15,
Yes, I know, thanks. That info was in his headers, but these days one
could guess (correctly) without even checking headers.
 
K

Ken1943

"Ken1943" wrote in message
"If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.

"Tom Lake" wrote in message No problem at all if you install it in a different partition or separate
physical hard drive.
On some of my machines, I run it in VirtualBox and can just delete it if I
want.

A virtual machine makes removal of Win8 (CP or RP) a lot easier.

Even with a different partition or separate hard drive, it is important to
note in a dual operating system environment (e.g. dual boot) the Win8 boot
loader GUI will supplant the previous o/s boot loader. If Win8 is removed,
it may necessitate a Windows repair (via Windows CD/DVD)...optionally one
can use a third party tool to reset/repair the boot files (on the System
partition).
But what about the users that don't know about using a different drive.
Someone installs the preview version, doesn't like it and learns they
have to use a restore disk and start from scratch.


KenW
 
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K

Ken1943

A restore disk they didn't create !!! I have two 340 gig drives with
XP that I saved when I updated to Win 7. If Win 8 upgrade DVD's will
allow clean install, I may try one (wiped of course). If I like I can
just upgrade my 500 gig Win 7 drives.


KenW
 
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W

...winston

"Ken1943" wrote in message

"Ken1943" wrote in message
"If it's like Win 7 he would need a clean 64 bit install ?
Don't know if it's true, but read that it is a real problem to uninstall
Win 8 if you don't like it.

"Tom Lake" wrote in message No problem at all if you install it in a different partition or separate
physical hard drive.
On some of my machines, I run it in VirtualBox and can just delete it if I
want.

A virtual machine makes removal of Win8 (CP or RP) a lot easier.

Even with a different partition or separate hard drive, it is important to
note in a dual operating system environment (e.g. dual boot) the Win8 boot
loader GUI will supplant the previous o/s boot loader. If Win8 is removed,
it may necessitate a Windows repair (via Windows CD/DVD)...optionally one
can use a third party tool to reset/repair the boot files (on the System
partition).
But what about the users that don't know about using a different drive.
Someone installs the preview version, doesn't like it and learns they
have to use a restore disk and start from scratch.


KenW
A good reason to investigate prior to jumping feet first from the previous
Window(s).
Possibly

cf.
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/faq
<qp>
You're comfortable backing up a PC, formatting a hard drive, and installing
an operating system from scratch.

You have the installation or recovery media and the knowledge to restore
your previous operating system after you're done testing Windows 8 Release
Preview.

To go back to your previous version of Windows, you'll need to reinstall it
from the recovery or installation media that came with your PC; typically
DVD media. If you don’t have recovery media you might be able to create it
from a recovery partition on your PC using software provided by your PC
manufacturer. Check the support section of your PC manufacturer’s website
for more information. After you install Windows 8, you won’t be able to use
the recovery partition on your PC to go back to your previous version of
Windows.
</qp>
 

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