How can I replace Win-7 video driver with Vista or XP driver?

X

XP Guy

I've got a desktop system where the motherboard has Intel 82G965/963
on-board graphics controller. I've installed both XP and Win-7 on this
system (but not on the same hard drive). So all I'm saying is that I
can run either XP or 7 on this system by selecting which drive is
connected to the system. (this is an experimental industrial / lab
system).

This is the 32-bit versions of XP and 7 (not 64 bit).

There's a 16-bit DOS program that I need to run on the system, and it
runs just fine in XP. The program runs in full-screen mode (takes over
the whole screen - it doesn't / can't run in a window).

The program will not run under win-7, because the win-7 video driver
won't allow a command-shell to run in full-screen mode. I've messed
with the file-properies of the 16-bit executable and that doesn't help
(well, it might help, but it doesn't get me where I need to go).

Now, I've searched the internet and have played around with wmic and
have "disabled" the video adapter in the device manager. When I disable
the video adapter, win-7 reverts to some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and
the DOS program will run ok in full-screen mode. But when I re-enable
the video adapter, the program won't run - and trying to run cmd from
the start menu is broken - it doesn't work any more (I think this has
something to do with the window properties I changes when running wmic).

Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?

I downloaded the vista driver for the G965/963 chipset from Intel, but
the setup program refuses to run (it says wrong OS) and even when I
unpack the driver package and try to point device manager to "update"
the driver, it refuses and says I already have the most recent (or most
appropriate) driver.

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
 
R

R. C. White

Hi, XP Guy.
I've installed both XP and Win-7 on this system...
WHICH Win7? Home? Professional? Ultimate?

Sounds like you need Win7's XP Mode. It is free, but can be installed only
Win7 Pro or Ultimate:
Install and use Windows XP Mode in Windows 7
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/install-and-use-windows-xp-mode-in-windows-7

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2011 (Build 15.4.3555.0308) in Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1


"XP Guy" wrote in message
I've got a desktop system where the motherboard has Intel 82G965/963
on-board graphics controller. I've installed both XP and Win-7 on this
system (but not on the same hard drive). So all I'm saying is that I
can run either XP or 7 on this system by selecting which drive is
connected to the system. (this is an experimental industrial / lab
system).

This is the 32-bit versions of XP and 7 (not 64 bit).

There's a 16-bit DOS program that I need to run on the system, and it
runs just fine in XP. The program runs in full-screen mode (takes over
the whole screen - it doesn't / can't run in a window).

The program will not run under win-7, because the win-7 video driver
won't allow a command-shell to run in full-screen mode. I've messed
with the file-properies of the 16-bit executable and that doesn't help
(well, it might help, but it doesn't get me where I need to go).

Now, I've searched the internet and have played around with wmic and
have "disabled" the video adapter in the device manager. When I disable
the video adapter, win-7 reverts to some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and
the DOS program will run ok in full-screen mode. But when I re-enable
the video adapter, the program won't run - and trying to run cmd from
the start menu is broken - it doesn't work any more (I think this has
something to do with the window properties I changes when running wmic).

Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?

I downloaded the vista driver for the G965/963 chipset from Intel, but
the setup program refuses to run (it says wrong OS) and even when I
unpack the driver package and try to point device manager to "update"
the driver, it refuses and says I already have the most recent (or most
appropriate) driver.

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

Hi, XP Guy.
WHICH Win7? Home? Professional? Ultimate?
Sounds like you need Win7's XP Mode. It is free, but can be installed only
Win7 Pro or Ultimate:
Install and use Windows XP Mode in Windows 7
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows7/install-and-use-windows-xp-mode-in-windows-7
Alternatively get VMware reader and a paid-for version of XP, if the
version of Win 7 doesn't allow XP Mode.
RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX
(e-mail address removed)
Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2011 (Build 15.4.3555.0308) in Win7 Ultimate x64 SP1

"XP Guy" wrote in message news:4F90B4A6.96363923@Guy.com...
I've got a desktop system where the motherboard has Intel 82G965/963
on-board graphics controller. I've installed both XP and Win-7 on this
system (but not on the same hard drive). So all I'm saying is that I
can run either XP or 7 on this system by selecting which drive is
connected to the system. (this is an experimental industrial / lab
system).
This is the 32-bit versions of XP and 7 (not 64 bit).
There's a 16-bit DOS program that I need to run on the system, and it
runs just fine in XP. The program runs in full-screen mode (takes over
the whole screen - it doesn't / can't run in a window).
The program will not run under win-7, because the win-7 video driver
won't allow a command-shell to run in full-screen mode. I've messed
with the file-properies of the 16-bit executable and that doesn't help
(well, it might help, but it doesn't get me where I need to go).
Now, I've searched the internet and have played around with wmic and
have "disabled" the video adapter in the device manager. When I disable
the video adapter, win-7 reverts to some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and
the DOS program will run ok in full-screen mode. But when I re-enable
the video adapter, the program won't run - and trying to run cmd from
the start menu is broken - it doesn't work any more (I think this has
something to do with the window properties I changes when running wmic).
Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?
 
X

XP Guy

Does it matter?

It's from technet. We have all versions. It wouldn't be home version.

No, I don't want to install XP mode, or VMware.

The software performs direct hardware access (using porttalk) so I don't
want to complicate things by running it in a VM (which it probably
wouldn't run correctly anyways).

I remember we tried running this in Windows Vista a few years ago and it
did run just fine - because Vista does (or did) allow full-screen DOS or
CMD mode.

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?[/QUOTE]

Assuming you meant "force 7" rather than "force XP" there: I think you
said earlier that 7 doesn't allow a cmd window to go full screen. If
this is truly the case (i. e. 7 doesn't allow full-screen CMD), then I
suspect that just having a driver which might allow it won't help.

Not that I think it'll help for the above reason, but you did say you
tried loading the Vista driver but it said you had a more recent one;
presumably you tried removing the 7 driver (assuming you've got it on a
disc so you can put it back when the attempt fails)?
 
S

SC Tom

XP Guy said:
I've got a desktop system where the motherboard has Intel 82G965/963
on-board graphics controller. I've installed both XP and Win-7 on this
system (but not on the same hard drive). So all I'm saying is that I
can run either XP or 7 on this system by selecting which drive is
connected to the system. (this is an experimental industrial / lab
system).

This is the 32-bit versions of XP and 7 (not 64 bit).

There's a 16-bit DOS program that I need to run on the system, and it
runs just fine in XP. The program runs in full-screen mode (takes over
the whole screen - it doesn't / can't run in a window).

The program will not run under win-7, because the win-7 video driver
won't allow a command-shell to run in full-screen mode. I've messed
with the file-properies of the 16-bit executable and that doesn't help
(well, it might help, but it doesn't get me where I need to go).

Now, I've searched the internet and have played around with wmic and
have "disabled" the video adapter in the device manager. When I disable
the video adapter, win-7 reverts to some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and
the DOS program will run ok in full-screen mode. But when I re-enable
the video adapter, the program won't run - and trying to run cmd from
the start menu is broken - it doesn't work any more (I think this has
something to do with the window properties I changes when running wmic).

Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?

I downloaded the vista driver for the G965/963 chipset from Intel, but
the setup program refuses to run (it says wrong OS) and even when I
unpack the driver package and try to point device manager to "update"
the driver, it refuses and says I already have the most recent (or most
appropriate) driver.

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
You'll have to uninstall the current Win7 driver first. Reboot, and when the "Found new hardware" comes up, cancel. It
will probably then leave you with the default VGA driver (this is good). Now you can install the Vista driver (you may
have to do it in Compatibility mode). I did something similar to this when I had to install an earlier ATI driver on my
laptop.
You also might have to either temporarily disable automatic updates, or change it to "notify me when. . ." in order to
keep it from installing an updated driver over your Vista one. If you choose "notify me. . .", then you can uncheck the
update, then right-click on it and select "Don't notify me of this driver again."

One machine I did this on, I had to boot into safe mode to do it all, but I don't remember if that was my Win7 or XP
machine (I love messing around with various programs and utilities; sometimes it bites me in the ass. Gotta love a
recent disk image :) )
 
Z

Zaphod Beeblebrox

I remember we tried running this in Windows Vista a few years ago and it
did run just fine - because Vista does (or did) allow full-screen DOS or
CMD mode.
FWIW, I just checked this on my Vista test platform and it did not
allow full-screen CMD modes, so you'll probably want to go with the XP
driver.

--
Zaphod

"So [Trillian], two heads is what does it for a girl?"
"...Anything else [Zaphod]'s got two of?"
- Arthur Dent
 
X

XP Guy

J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
I think you said earlier that 7 doesn't allow a cmd window to go
full screen. If this is truly the case
Do a google search for this phrase:

"windows 7" full screen dos mode

You'll see this is a real behavior or observation.

In XP, if you open a command shell and hit alt-enter, you'll see that
the window will open to full-screen. You can't do that with Windows 7.

I know this did work a few years ago when we tried this on a different
machine running Vista - but this could very well have been a pre-release
candidate of Vista.

I see that this full-screen ability must have been taken away from
Vista:

http://www.mydigitallife.info/workaround-to-this-system-does-not-support-full-screen-mode-in-windows-vista/

============
When you attempt open or run DOS .com applications, .bat batch scripts
or games that relies on command prompt, and including cmd.exe itself,
you will encounter the following error message:

This system does not support fullscreen mode. Choose “Close” to
terminate the application.

The lack of support for full screen DOS command prompt in Windows Vista
is a big annoyance especially for those who still playing games for DOS
and Windows 3.1/9x era, use legacy software such as WPDOS or programmers
who frequently switch to command prompt to use DOS based programming
language such as PASCAL.
=============

I'm getting the exact same error message for the 16-bit app I'm trying
to run under win-7.

I'll have to try the trick shown on that page to run the Vista video
driver install program under XP compatibility mode. If the Vista driver
still won't let me have full-screen mode, then I'll try the XP driver.
(I don't care if I lose the aero mode).
you did say you tried loading the Vista driver but it said you
had a more recent one; presumably you tried removing the 7 driver
(assuming you've got it on a disc so you can put it back when
the attempt fails)?
I'm not sure how to tell win-7 to "remove" the existing driver (vs
replace or update the driver). The existing driver must be part of
win-7 because I didn't have to feed it to win-7 during installation of
the OS. So it must be part of win-7 core install files.
 
Y

Yousuf Khan

Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?

I downloaded the vista driver for the G965/963 chipset from Intel, but
the setup program refuses to run (it says wrong OS) and even when I
unpack the driver package and try to point device manager to "update"
the driver, it refuses and says I already have the most recent (or most
appropriate) driver.

So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
The XP driver definitely won't work, the driver model is too different
between XP and 7. However, the Win7 driver model was first introduced in
Vista, so that one might work, if you can find a way to uninstall the
existing Windows 7 driver.

Yousuf Khan
 
Y

Yousuf Khan

No, I don't want to install XP mode, or VMware.

The software performs direct hardware access (using porttalk) so I don't
want to complicate things by running it in a VM (which it probably
wouldn't run correctly anyways).
You seem to distrust virtualization's capabilities. Most of these
virtualization software will also virtualize the ports and make it look
like it's running on a bog standard VGA or SVGA adapter of some kind. So
even direct hardware port accesses are also virtualized. If you got the
Ultimate or Pro, then go ahead and install the XP Mode on the machine,
it'll only take up a bit of your time, and you'll never know it works
until you try it. In fact, running the Sysinfo under my XP Mode, I see
it sees an S3 Trio video adapter running. My system is actually running
an AMD Radeon HD 6870, so it's obviously virtualized.

There's nothing complicated about it, XP Mode doesn't run automatically
at Windows startup, so it doesn't take up any resources until you click
on it.

Yousuf Khan
 
X

XP Guy

Yousuf said:
You seem to distrust virtualization's capabilities. Most of these
virtualization software will also virtualize the ports and make it
look like it's running on a bog standard VGA or SVGA adapter of
some kind. So even direct hardware port accesses are also
virtualized.
The hardware ports belong to a proprietary data-acquisition interface
card that does not have any windows drivers.

So unless there's something about virtualization that I don't
understand, I can't see how my 16-bit app is going to be able to
directly access the real physical ports through the virtualization
layer.
If you got the Ultimate or Pro, then go ahead and install the
XP Mode on the machine, it'll only take up a bit of your time,
and you'll never know it works until you try it.
I still don't see how virtualization gets around the full-screen DOS
issue.

Even if virtualization allows the program to run in a virtualized
"full-screen window", the application performs a lot of real-time data
plotting on screen so I have to wonder about performance.
 
K

Ken Blake

Something else that might work is to replace the win-7 video driver with
either Vista or XP versions - and here is where I'm running into
problems: How do I force win-7 to use these drivers?


"Force"? You can't force anything like this. Some Vista drivers
*might* work, but XP drivers never will.
 
T

Tony

Is that you Steve?

XP said:
The hardware ports belong to a proprietary data-acquisition interface
card that does not have any windows drivers.

So unless there's something about virtualization that I don't
understand, I can't see how my 16-bit app is going to be able to
directly access the real physical ports through the virtualization
layer.


I still don't see how virtualization gets around the full-screen DOS
issue.

Even if virtualization allows the program to run in a virtualized
"full-screen window", the application performs a lot of real-time data
plotting on screen so I have to wonder about performance.
--
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG

Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city

Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know
proper manners

Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs but got fired the first
day on the job for potty mouth,

Bur-ring, i'll get this one: WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM JERK!!? We're here to
help you dickweed, ok, ok give the power cord the jiggily piggily wiggily
all the while pushing the power button repeatedly now take everything out
of your computer except the power supply and *one* stick of ram. Ok get
the next sucker on the phone.

Deirdre Straughan (Roxio) is a LIAR (Deirdre McFibber)

There's the employer and the employee and the FROGGER and the FROGEE,
which one are you?

Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!

El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar (I just got EL-FROG-OED!!)

I hate them both, With useless bogus bullshit you need at least *three*
fulltime jobs to afford either one of them

I'm a fulltime text *only* man on usenet now. The rest of the world
downloads the binary files not me i can't afford thousands of dollars a
month

VBB = Volume based billing. How many bytes can we shove down your throat
and out your arse sir?

UBB = User based bullFROGGING

Master Juba was a black man imitating a white man imitating a black man

Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions
beyond the realm of understandability

Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday

This sig file was compiled via my journeys through usenet
 
Z

Zaphod Beeblebrox

You seem to distrust virtualization's capabilities. Most of these
virtualization software will also virtualize the ports and make it
look like it's running on a bog standard VGA or SVGA adapter of
some kind. So even direct hardware port accesses are also
virtualized.
The hardware ports belong to a proprietary data-acquisition interface
card that does not have any windows drivers.

So unless there's something about virtualization that I don't
understand, I can't see how my 16-bit app is going to be able to
directly access the real physical ports through the virtualization
layer.
If you got the Ultimate or Pro, then go ahead and install the
XP Mode on the machine, it'll only take up a bit of your time,
and you'll never know it works until you try it.
I still don't see how virtualization gets around the full-screen DOS
issue.

Even if virtualization allows the program to run in a virtualized
"full-screen window", the application performs a lot of real-time data
plotting on screen so I have to wonder about performance.[/QUOTE]

Our hardware developers have been moving back to running on the host OS
instead of in virtual machines after a brief attempt at doing
everything in a VM and only using the host OS for virtualization for
these very reasons. Hardware just doesn't behave the same in a virtual
environment as it does on the host OS.

--
Zaphod

"So [Trillian], two heads is what does it for a girl?"
"...Anything else [Zaphod]'s got two of?"
- Arthur Dent
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message said:
FWIW, I just checked this on my Vista test platform and it did not
allow full-screen CMD modes, so you'll probably want to go with the XP
driver.
Surely, if the underlying OS doesn't support full-screen (a. k. a.
character) mode, then no matter whether the driver supports it, you
won't be able to use it?
 
G

Gene E. Bloch

"Gene E. Bloch" wrote:
No he didn't.
Does it matter?
It's from technet. We have all versions. It wouldn't be home version.
No, I don't want to install XP mode, or VMware.
The software performs direct hardware access (using porttalk) so I don't
want to complicate things by running it in a VM (which it probably
wouldn't run correctly anyways).
I remember we tried running this in Windows Vista a few years ago and it
did run just fine - because Vista does (or did) allow full-screen DOS or
CMD mode.
So - is there any way I can force XP to install and use either an XP or
Vista video driver - so that (theoretically) I can have a true
full-screen DOS (CMD) mode?
Everything above that you are responding to above was from R. C. White,
not Gene E. Bloch...

Well, almost - you did mention (without otherwise quoting me) VMware.

It's just that I am very modest, so I don't want credit that I don't
deserve :)
 
B

Bill Bradshaw

XP Guy said:
I've got a desktop system where the motherboard has Intel 82G965/963
on-board graphics controller. I've installed both XP and Win-7 on
this
system (but not on the same hard drive). So all I'm saying is that I
can run either XP or 7 on this system by selecting which drive is
connected to the system. (this is an experimental industrial / lab
system).

This is the 32-bit versions of XP and 7 (not 64 bit).

There's a 16-bit DOS program that I need to run on the system, and it
runs just fine in XP. The program runs in full-screen mode (takes
over
the whole screen - it doesn't / can't run in a window).

I still run one DOS program and use DOSBox (search for it). It runs DOS
programs much faster than WinXP Mode or any of the other emulators I
have tried. You can run DOS program windowed or pretty much full
screen. You will need to study the ".conf" file and play with it a
little bit to understand its options. It is worth while for running DOS
programs.
 
Z

Zaphod Beeblebrox

On Fri, 20 Apr 2012 18:50:52 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
Surely, if the underlying OS doesn't support full-screen (a. k. a.
character) mode, then no matter whether the driver supports it, you
won't be able to use it?
It is the driver that is the problem, not the underlying OS. I've seen
where some had success installing the XP video driver in Vista to
restore that functionality. Also, in the OP, XP Guy said:
When I disable the video adapter, win-7 reverts to
some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and the DOS program
will run ok in full-screen mode.
So his test really does show that isn't the OS but the driver that is
the issue.


--
Zaphod

Adventurer, ex-hippie, good-timer (crook? quite possibly),
manic self-publicist, terrible bad at personal relationships,
often thought to be completely out to lunch.
 
G

Gene Wirchenko

[snip]
I still run one DOS program and use DOSBox (search for it). It runs DOS
programs much faster than WinXP Mode or any of the other emulators I
have tried. You can run DOS program windowed or pretty much full
screen. You will need to study the ".conf" file and play with it a
little bit to understand its options. It is worth while for running DOS
programs.
I use DOSBox for running WordStar 2000.

OP, note that DOSBox is meant for running games. If you use it
for other than that, you are on your own. This is frequently stated
by the developers. That caveat stated, DOSBox works fine for me. I
have used it for several years.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

In message said:
[]
Surely, if the underlying OS doesn't support full-screen (a. k. a.
character) mode, then no matter whether the driver supports it, you
won't be able to use it?
It is the driver that is the problem, not the underlying OS. I've seen
where some had success installing the XP video driver in Vista to
restore that functionality. Also, in the OP, XP Guy said:
When I disable the video adapter, win-7 reverts to
some sort of 800 x 600 VGA mode and the DOS program
will run ok in full-screen mode.
So his test really does show that isn't the OS but the driver that is
the issue.
Sorry, I hadn't spotted him saying it _did_ run in full-screen mode in
that mode.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G.5AL-IS-P--Ch++(p)Ar@T0H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

He spoke in sentences that made up paragraphs, with immaculate grammar and
punctuation. - Barry Cryer on Clement Freud 1924-2009, in Radio Times, 25 April
- 1 May 2009.
 

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