Defragging System Volume Information

My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will probably
have to be done during startup.
--
Crash

"When you get to a fork in the road, take it."
~ Yogi Berra ~

"Dave "Crash" Dummy" <> wrote in message news:j4h12n$l8j$...
> My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
> System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
> nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
> utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will probably
> have to be done during startup.

Auslogics Disk Defrag will take care of it:

http://www.auslogics.com/en/software/disk-defrag/

--
SC Tom

Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
> My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
> System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
> nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
> utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will
> probably
> have to be done during startup.

Just for fun, have you ever tried "Contig" ?

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/s...rnals/bb897428

It meets the dictionary definition of defragmentation, in that
the moved file is no longer fragmented. But the file is just,
more or less, randomly placed on the partition, so it is
more likely that the next file written will be fragmented.
You might easily use "Contig", one file at a time, until
there is no free space suitable for contiguous repositioning.
It only has a fraction of the logic in it that a real
defragmenter uses.

The other nice thing about Contig, is you may be able to
create a list of the files that are fragmented with it. I seem
to remember, it scanned the partition pretty rapidly. It might
even double as a way to create a file list...

******* One entry from the 45MB listing it creates for my C: partition *******

Processing C:\\System Volume Information\_restore{AAB841EA-B06A-40C3-BFFE-A97A5C886FBA}\RP110\snapshot\
_REGISTRY_USER_NTUSER_S-1-5-21-1614895754-179605362-1177238915-1003:

Scanning file...
File size: 5971968 bytes

C:\\System Volume Information\_restore{AAB841EA-B06A-40C3-BFFE-A97A5C886FBA}\RP110\snapshot\
_REGISTRY_USER_NTUSER_S-1-5-21-1614895754-179605362-1177238915-1003 is in 1 fragment

*******************************************************************************

If you take the resultant output file, and in a text editor look
for the word "fragments", that will help you identify all the files
which have more than one fragment. For example, if a file had two
fragments, the output would say "is in 2 fragments".

On Windows 7, you'd likely need to elevate the command, and I'd
expect "more flak" from using it, than I see on WinXP with FAT32.

"Contig" is purely for amusement value. A real defragmenter will spend time
positioning the files in a certain way, which may in the long run
work slightly better. Or the graph at least, will look better.

Paul

SC Tom wrote:

> Dave Crash Dummy wrote:
>
>> My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
>> System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
>> nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
>> utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will probably
>> have to be done during startup.
>
> Auslogics Disk Defrag will take care of it:
>
> http://www.auslogics.com/en/software/disk-defrag/

Depends on WHAT file(s) are not getting defragmented for the OP in his
computer. There are some files that defraggers won't touch.

http://www.techsupportalert.com/best...#comment-58982

After reading the following article, it appears those scattered NTFS
files the defraggers wouldn't touch were the $LOGFILE. This file gets
scattered across the OS partition because new blocks get created due to
other files occupying the disk space but these blocks won't coalesce
together later with a defrag.

http://mindprod.com/jgloss/defragger.html

Alas, this doesn't include the Auslogics defragger (that I use). The
article mentions Auslogics but doesn't include it in the feature
comparison chart. It's been too long to remember if this one will move
the $LOGFILE into one contiguous chunk of sectors in the OS partition (I
suspect that it does not hence why I found re-imaging the partition
worked to defrag this part of NTFS).

Although a product may claim it will defrag "system files", that does
not equate to "file system" files. Windows system files are still
system files despite which file system you choose (FAT vs. NTFS).

For a defragmenter to be considered safe, it should use the defrag API
provided by Windows; however, that means files opened for exclusive
access cannot be moved by safe defragger. Some defraggers include a
boot-time defrag operation to run before the files are exclusively
allocated. Auslogics defragger doesn't include a boot-time defragger
(they want you to buy their Bootspeed product for $40) hence the need
for something more, like the old SysInternals' PageDefrag utility that
worked on Windows XP (it won't defrag the pagefile on Windows
Vista/7/Server2008, can defrag the registry hives, and I don't know
about the NTFS files). Either a defragger that will run at Windows
boot-time or one that lets you create a bootable disc (which means the
OS partition being defragged is quiescent since the OS isn't running)
will move those obstinate NTFS files.

Whether or not you have to move around those NTFS or other exclusively
locked files depends on what files you'll be later putting into that
partition. Although you might have tons of free space reported for the
partition, the myriad of tiny portions of the $LOGFILE spread all over
can result in no *contiguous* free space large enough for you to copy a
huge file into that partition. I haven't before bothered looking around
for free defragmenters that include a boot-time scan so Auslogics meets
my needs. If I feel compelled to get some huge file into one contiguous
chunk then re-imaging the partition might be faster than running a
boot-time defrag.

There are payware defraggers with boot-time operation that will
completely defrag even the metafiles for the file system; however, the
OP expressed criteria that the defragger must be free. IObit's
defragger includes boot-time defrags but I'm always leery of anything
from IObit. Also, see the jgloss article linked above regarding
deficiencies of IObit defragger (yeah, it has a boot-time scan but falls
short on other features). Piriform's Defraggler has a boot-time scan.
Although I use Auslogics for scheduled defragging, I also have
Defraggler installed in case I want to do a boot-time scan (which has
been so rare that I can't remember the last time that I did a boot-time
defrag). There is Puran Defrag Free Edition which has boot-time defrag
but I've never used it.

Warning: Do NOT run an incremental or differential image backup on the
same day you defrag your disk(s). You'll end up with huge backups
because all the physical relocation of the files. Incrementals and
differentials are used to create small backups and you defeat that
purpose if you defrag and then run these backups. Schedule the defrag
to run and complete on the same day and before you run a full backup,
and do not defrag on the days you run the incremental or differential
backups. Hence it is unwise to use on-the-fly defraggers that will
defrag when your computer goes idle or to configure boot-time defraggers
to run on every boot.

Oops, I see the OP said it was the "System Volume Information" folder
and its contents that Defraggler won't touch. It probably does this
because those files could be locked for exclusive access. THE SVI is
used for:

• System Restore points. You can disable System Restore from the
"System" control panel.
• Distributed Link Tracking Service databases for repairing your
shortcuts and linked documents.
• Content Indexing Service databases for fast file searches. This is
also the source of the cidaemon.exe process: That is the content
indexer itself, busy scanning your files and building its database so
you can search for them quickly. (If you created a lot of data in a
short time, the content indexer service gets all excited trying to
index it.)
• Information used by the Volume Snapshot Service (also known as "Volume
Shadow Copy") so you can back up files on a live system.
(http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/.../20/55764.aspx)

Since the OP already has Defraggler installed, he might try using its
boot-time defrag (and when the files won't be locked) to see if the
unmovable file(s) gets moved.

VanguardLH wrote:
> Oops, I see the OP said it was the "System Volume Information" folder
> and its contents that Defraggler won't touch. It probably does this
> because those files could be locked for exclusive access. THE SVI
> is used for:
>
> • System Restore points. You can disable System Restore from the
> "System" control panel. • Distributed Link Tracking Service databases
> for repairing your shortcuts and linked documents. • Content Indexing
> Service databases for fast file searches. This is also the source of
> the cidaemon.exe process: That is the content indexer itself, busy
> scanning your files and building its database so you can search for
> them quickly. (If you created a lot of data in a short time, the
> content indexer service gets all excited trying to index it.) •
> Information used by the Volume Snapshot Service (also known as
> "Volume Shadow Copy") so you can back up files on a live system.
> (http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/.../20/55764.aspx)
>
> Since the OP already has Defraggler installed, he might try using its
> boot-time defrag (and when the files won't be locked) to see if the
> unmovable file(s) gets moved.

Thank you for your extensive discussion. I am not willing to take any
drastic, possibly dangerous, measures for what is essentially a cosmetic
fix. I just wondered if there was a utility that did the job. BTW, the
boot time defrag option is grayed out in my 64 bit Defraggler (v. 2.06.328).
--
Crash

"The fewer the facts, the stronger the opinion."
~ Arnold H. Glasow ~

On 11/09/2011 12:51, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
> VanguardLH wrote:
>> Oops, I see the OP said it was the "System Volume Information" folder
>> and its contents that Defraggler won't touch. It probably does this
>> because those files could be locked for exclusive access. THE SVI
>> is used for:
>>
>> • System Restore points. You can disable System Restore from the
>> "System" control panel. • Distributed Link Tracking Service databases
>> for repairing your shortcuts and linked documents. • Content Indexing
>> Service databases for fast file searches. This is also the source of
>> the cidaemon.exe process: That is the content indexer itself, busy
>> scanning your files and building its database so you can search for
>> them quickly. (If you created a lot of data in a short time, the
>> content indexer service gets all excited trying to index it.) •
>> Information used by the Volume Snapshot Service (also known as
>> "Volume Shadow Copy") so you can back up files on a live system.
>> (http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/.../20/55764.aspx)
>>
>> Since the OP already has Defraggler installed, he might try using its
>> boot-time defrag (and when the files won't be locked) to see if the
>> unmovable file(s) gets moved.
>
> Thank you for your extensive discussion. I am not willing to take any
> drastic, possibly dangerous, measures for what is essentially a cosmetic
> fix. I just wondered if there was a utility that did the job. BTW, the
> boot time defrag option is grayed out in my 64 bit Defraggler (v. 2.06.328).

Probably a silly question, but would it be possible to use a linux live
CD to defrag the hard disk - including the SVI file - if such a defrag
utility existed on the CD?

The second post here:
http://unix.stackexchange.com/questi...tfs-partitions
suggests there might be a possibility of doing it. Might be best to
image the Win7 HD first, though. :-)

--

Jeff

Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 11/09/2011 12:51, Dave "Crash" Dummy wrote:
>> VanguardLH wrote:
>>> Oops, I see the OP said it was the "System Volume Information"
>>> folder and its contents that Defraggler won't touch. It probably
>>> does this because those files could be locked for exclusive
>>> access. THE SVI is used for:
>>>
>>> • System Restore points. You can disable System Restore from the
>>> "System" control panel. • Distributed Link Tracking Service
>>> databases for repairing your shortcuts and linked documents. •
>>> Content Indexing Service databases for fast file searches. This
>>> is also the source of the cidaemon.exe process: That is the
>>> content indexer itself, busy scanning your files and building its
>>> database so you can search for them quickly. (If you created a
>>> lot of data in a short time, the content indexer service gets all
>>> excited trying to index it.) • Information used by the Volume
>>> Snapshot Service (also known as "Volume Shadow Copy") so you can
>>> back up files on a live system.
>>> (http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/.../20/55764.aspx)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Since the OP already has Defraggler installed, he might try using
>>> its boot-time defrag (and when the files won't be locked) to see
>>> if the unmovable file(s) gets moved.
>>
>> Thank you for your extensive discussion. I am not willing to take
>> any drastic, possibly dangerous, measures for what is essentially a
>> cosmetic fix. I just wondered if there was a utility that did the
>> job. BTW, the boot time defrag option is grayed out in my 64 bit
>> Defraggler (v. 2.06.328).
>
> Probably a silly question, but would it be possible to use a linux
> live CD to defrag the hard disk - including the SVI file - if such a
> defrag utility existed on the CD?
>
> The second post here:
> http://unix.stackexchange.com/questi...tfs-partitions
>
>
>
> suggests there might be a possibility of doing it. Might be best to
> image the Win7 HD first, though. :-)

That possibility occurred to me. I haven't explored it, yet. And I would
definitely image the drive, first! My weekly imaging (with two different
programs) takes place tonight. Maybe I'll boot my Linux CD tomorrow and
see if it has a NTFS defragger utility.

--
Crash

Atheism is a matter of faith, too.

> SC Tom wrote:
>
>> Dave Crash Dummy wrote:
>>
>>> My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
>>> System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
>>> nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
>>> utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will
>>> probably have to be done during startup.
>>
>> Auslogics Disk Defrag will take care of it:
>>
>> http://www.auslogics.com/en/software/disk-defrag/
>
> Depends on WHAT file(s) are not getting defragmented for the OP in his
> computer. There are some files that defraggers won't touch.
>
> http://www.techsupportalert.com/best...#comment-58982
>
> After reading the following article, it appears those scattered NTFS
> files the defraggers wouldn't touch were the $LOGFILE. This file gets
> scattered across the OS partition because new blocks get created due to
> other files occupying the disk space but these blocks won't coalesce
> together later with a defrag.
>
> http://mindprod.com/jgloss/defragger.html
>
> Alas, this doesn't include the Auslogics defragger (that I use). The
> article mentions Auslogics but doesn't include it in the feature
> comparison chart. It's been too long to remember if this one will move
> the $LOGFILE into one contiguous chunk of sectors in the OS partition (I
> suspect that it does not hence why I found re-imaging the partition
> worked to defrag this part of NTFS).
>
> Although a product may claim it will defrag "system files", that does
> not equate to "file system" files. Windows system files are still
> system files despite which file system you choose (FAT vs. NTFS).
>
> For a defragmenter to be considered safe, it should use the defrag API
> provided by Windows; however, that means files opened for exclusive
> access cannot be moved by safe defragger. Some defraggers include a
> boot-time defrag operation to run before the files are exclusively
> allocated. Auslogics defragger doesn't include a boot-time defragger
> (they want you to buy their Bootspeed product for $40) hence the need
> for something more, like the old SysInternals' PageDefrag utility that
> worked on Windows XP (it won't defrag the pagefile on Windows
> Vista/7/Server2008, can defrag the registry hives, and I don't know
> about the NTFS files). Either a defragger that will run at Windows
> boot-time or one that lets you create a bootable disc (which means the
> OS partition being defragged is quiescent since the OS isn't running)
> will move those obstinate NTFS files.
>
> Whether or not you have to move around those NTFS or other exclusively
> locked files depends on what files you'll be later putting into that
> partition. Although you might have tons of free space reported for the
> partition, the myriad of tiny portions of the $LOGFILE spread all over
> can result in no *contiguous* free space large enough for you to copy a
> huge file into that partition. I haven't before bothered looking around
> for free defragmenters that include a boot-time scan so Auslogics meets
> my needs. If I feel compelled to get some huge file into one contiguous
> chunk then re-imaging the partition might be faster than running a
> boot-time defrag.
>
> There are payware defraggers with boot-time operation that will
> completely defrag even the metafiles for the file system; however, the
> OP expressed criteria that the defragger must be free. IObit's
> defragger includes boot-time defrags but I'm always leery of anything
> from IObit. Also, see the jgloss article linked above regarding
> deficiencies of IObit defragger (yeah, it has a boot-time scan but falls
> short on other features). Piriform's Defraggler has a boot-time scan.
> Although I use Auslogics for scheduled defragging, I also have
> Defraggler installed in case I want to do a boot-time scan (which has
> been so rare that I can't remember the last time that I did a boot-time
> defrag). There is Puran Defrag Free Edition which has boot-time defrag
> but I've never used it.
>
> Warning: Do NOT run an incremental or differential image backup on the
> same day you defrag your disk(s). You'll end up with huge backups
> because all the physical relocation of the files. Incrementals and
> differentials are used to create small backups and you defeat that
> purpose if you defrag and then run these backups. Schedule the defrag
> to run and complete on the same day and before you run a full backup,
> and do not defrag on the days you run the incremental or differential
> backups. Hence it is unwise to use on-the-fly defraggers that will
> defrag when your computer goes idle or to configure boot-time defraggers
> to run on every boot.

A very interesting and informative reply, particularly on the issue of
defragging and backups.

Not in response to the OP question; just an observation.
I have had numerous computers running XP, Vista and Win 7. On the XP
and Vista systems I used Diskeeper for defragging continually in the
background. I cannot say whether Diskeepers' claims of using their
software gives faster performance or not as I did not experience any
slowness of any computers.

What I have done on the Win 7 computer is to set it up differently. I
have partitioned the hard drive with 100GB for the operating system and
programs, and 500GB for personal files, at the moment there is 48 and
350GB of files on these partitions. I have also opted to use free
software where possible to cut personal costs. This computer has been
running now for just over a year with no Diskeeper installed. I
installed Auslogics Disk Defrag after about a month. So far I have not
had to defrag either partition, they are currently 2 and 3% fragmented.
This computer is used extensively every day for email, newsgroups,
downloading and uploading and general office work of image
manipulation, word processing and dtp. Synchronising every 2 or 3 days
usually indicates about 150 file deletions, 200 file changes and about
300 new files. I always use Ccleaner before every sync or backup to
rid the system of junk and temporary files.

I would have thought that there would be much more fragmentation than I
have got. I am pleased I have saved by not buying Diskeeper again and
it also saves the hard disk constantly churning away and (wearing out
quicker?), Auslogics will be used instead, probably soon, but once in
a year is pretty negligible.

Am I experiencing normal fragmented percentages or was Diskeeper over
emphasising fragmentation?

--
mick

"SC Tom" <> wrote in message news:j4h2eb$s4c$...
>
> "Dave "Crash" Dummy" <> wrote in message
> news:j4h12n$l8j$...
>> My Windows 7 x64 system has 6 fragmented files totaling 3 GB in the
>> System Volume Information folder. Neither the included Windows defragger
>> nor Piriform Defraggler64 will touch them. Does anyone know of a free
>> utility that will defragment these files? I understand that it will
>> probably
>> have to be done during startup.
>
> Auslogics Disk Defrag will take care of it:
>
> http://www.auslogics.com/en/software/disk-defrag/
>
> --
> SC Tom

I like Puran. It does a boot time defrag and optimization.

http://www.puransoftware.com/Puran-Defrag-Download.html